Illegal shift, or not?

[HawkeyeCubP]

Illegal motion. A player who takes a position as a lineman and then goes in motion must be at least 5 yards behind the line of scrimmage at the snap.

[Bob M.]

REPLY: For Fed, this could not be illegal motion since the OP implies that A10 had stopped moving but that the snap ensued less than the required one second later. Since he stopped, it was a shift. Since he was not motionless for 1 second prior to the snap, that shift was illegal.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Originally Posted by Bob M.

REPLY: For Fed, this could not be illegal motion since the OP implies that A10 had stopped moving but that the snap ensued less than the required one second later. Since he stopped, it was a shift. Since he was not motionless for 1 second prior to the snap, that shift was illegal.

I'm tired, but don't we need at least two people for an illegal shift?

Illegal Motion - 7-2-7-Penalty, verbatim.

[cdoug]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

I'm tired, but don't we need at least two people for an illegal shift?

Illegal Motion - 7-2-7-Penalty, verbatim.

Definition of a shift: "...the action of one or more players who. after a huddle or after taking set positions, move to a new set position before the ensuing snap."

7.2.6: "After a huddle or shift all 11 players of A shall come to an absolute stop and shall remain stationary simultaneously without movement of hands, feet, head or body for at least one second before the snap."

I'm calling illegal shift.

[Bob M.]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

I'm tired, but don't we need at least two people for an illegal shift?

Illegal Motion - 7-2-7-Penalty, verbatim.

REPLY: Hawkeye...in NCAA yes, but in Federation rules, movement by one or more to new set positions constitutes a shift.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Guys -

I could see where case play 7.2.7(b) would support an illegal shift call here, but 7-2-7 actually describes this exact situation:

Only one A player may be in motion at the snap and then only if such motion is not toward his opponent's goal line. Except for the player "under the snapper," as outlined in Article 3, the player in motion shall be at least 5 yards behind his line of scrimmage at the snap if he started from any position not clearly behind the line and did not establish himself as a back by stopping for at least one full second while no part of his body is breaking the vertical plane through the waistline of his nearest teammate who is on the line of scrimmage.

Penalty: Illegal Motion (Art. 7) - (S20)

[Bob M.]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

Guys -

I could see where case play 7.2.7(b) would support an illegal shift call here, but 7-2-7 actually describes this exact situation:

REPLY: Except that in the original play, the player is no longer moving--he has stopped, but was stopped for less than the required one second. It can no longer be illegal motion in that case since he's not moving. The rule you quote presumes that the player in question is still moving.

[HawkeyeCubP]

I see what you're saying, Bob. And I know we're splitting hairs at this point, but I still think, technically, that that sentence doesn't necessarilly presume that the player has not stopped moving - it technically reads that the player either 1) hasn't stopped moving, or 2) has stopped, but for less than one full second. If it presumed what you say, it would simply read, "and has not established himself as a back by stopping."

I'm sure everyone is taking some valuable knowledge and insight away from this thread, at this point.