OSU Purdue Incomplete Pass or Fumble

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by MJT

What I am saying is if the QB is moving his arm forward to throw the ball, but changes his mind and he stops his arm (as in the play described) but the ball comes out, I think it is considered a forward pass.

That's pretty much the opposite of what you said in the first post.

Yes - if the QB is moving his arm forward in a passing motion, and the ball comes out, it's a forward pass. Your first post says fumble (which is why the first response to you was "What?!?!?!")

[MJT]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

That's pretty much the opposite of what you said in the first post.

Yes - if the QB is moving his arm forward in a passing motion, and the ball comes out, it's a forward pass. Your first post says fumble (which is why the first response to you was "What?!?!?!")

Whoops! I never saw that, but I meant NOT a fumble. Thanks.

[NickelDeuce]

I believe w sohl hit the nail on the head. The R very well could have thought this was an incomplete pass but went with fumble so replay could take a look. That's the philosophy they teach those guys. When in doubt, it's a fumble. That doesn't excuse them from stepping up and making an incomplete call when it's there but I totally agree that if there is a little bit of doubt, go with fumble.

[Warrenkicker]

Originally Posted by MJT

Whoops! I never saw that, but I meant NOT a fumble. Thanks.

Now I can go back to believing you again.

[FeetBallRef]

So if we all agree that it was a pass then why wouldn't it be intentional grounding because there were no receivers in the area.

[bigjohn]

He didn't INTEND to Throw the ball???

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by FeetBallRef

So if we all agree that it was a pass then why wouldn't it be intentional grounding because there were no receivers in the area.

Because of that pesky word "intentional". Read the IG rule if you need clarification - it specifies for you when that rule comes into play.

[bigjohn]

His intent was to not throw the ball but it came out of his hand, so it should be a fumble!

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

His intent was to not throw the ball but it came out of his hand, so it should be a fumble!

Please check with your training organization to see what they expect you to call. Me --- I see this call being on the training film as an incomplete pass next off-season.

[FeetBallRef]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Because of that pesky word "intentional". Read the IG rule if you need clarification - it specifies for you when that rule comes into play.

Going out on a limb here, so don't pound to hard.

He did intentionally change the direction of his throw so that his arm was swinging downward when the ball came out. If his release had been intentional, the ball would have landed at the heels of the offensive linemen therefore the IG would apply. Since his release of the ball was unintentional, we'll signal a incomplete pass even though his intentional direction was down.

What if the hand went down further and the unintentional release of the ball caused the ball to go parallel to or toward A's endline. Would this still be ruled an incomplete pass because he unintentionally released the ball or is it now a fumble since the unintentional release of the pass was parallel to or toward A's endline?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by FeetBallRef

Going out on a limb here, so don't pound to hard.

He did intentionally change the direction of his throw so that his arm was swinging downward when the ball came out. If his release had been intentional, the ball would have landed at the heels of the offensive linemen therefore the IG would apply. Since his release of the ball was unintentional, we'll signal a incomplete pass even though his intentional direction was down.

What if the hand went down further and the unintentional release of the ball caused the ball to go parallel to or toward A's endline. Would this still be ruled an incomplete pass because he unintentionally released the ball or is it now a fumble since the unintentional release of the pass was parallel to or toward A's endline?

I'll try to be nice ... but this is truly a simple call. Surely the fact that there's been NO outrage, NO confession of a screwed up call, NO complaints from the offended team in the actual game we're talking about should lead you to the conclusion that what we are telling you is correct.

Are you an official? If so, this discourse frightens me. You seem to WANT a penalty here... to the point that you're making efforts to bend the wording of rules to fit your preconceived notion. I would expect an official not to do this. You obviously don't believe us ... go ask your mentor, your trainers, etc.

This situation is really not that uncommon. Passer starts to pass, changes his mind, and the ball goes somewhere he didn't intend. This has been an incomplete pass in all rule codes for several years. I believe it may have been different when I was very young ... but not now.

(And note - if the unintentional pass was CLEARLY backward, then you simply have an uncaught backward pass, and all that implies. And remember - when in doubt, a pass is forward.)

[MJT]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Because of that pesky word "intentional". Read the IG rule if you need clarification - it specifies for you when that rule comes into play.

Feetballref, I'm glad you are hearing the same thing on different boards, from different officials. That should add some validity to the answer.