Two Scenarios from Last Night

[Bob M.]

REPLY: Not sure that would be a good rule Monte. Consider...if you had such a rule, then a team could gain an advantage (time) by fouling when distance is of no consequence. That is, by fouling, a team could trade an insignificant five yards for a much more valuable stopped clock.

[Bob M.]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

...Would you want to penalize a request for a measurement based on your guess that the captain requesting it didn't really believe it was necessary?

REPLY: My only concern during potential measurement situations is whether I believe it's necessary. If a captain requests one and I don't feel it's necessary, he doesn't get it. I wouldn't 'penalize' his request; I just wouldn't grant it. That way, I don't need to consider any possible ulterior motives in his asking for it.

[MJT]

Originally Posted by Bob M.

REPLY: Not sure that would be a good rule Monte. Consider...if you had such a rule, then a team could gain an advantage (time) by fouling when distance is of no consequence. That is, by fouling, a team could trade an insignificant five yards for a much more valuable stopped clock.

I hear you there, Bob, but it would be nice to ding them for something!

[andy1033]

The only time you let a team call a timeout when they have not left, is when the coach wants an interperation. So you must know what the request is for.

[wisref2]

1 - you can't penalize a team because the officials made a mistake. The rule covers this - look it up in the casebook, maybe it's covered there (granting TO when none are available).

2 - The rule says nothing about breaking the huddle with 12. It states that it is a violation for a replaced player to not leave immediately (NF, about 3-5 seconds).

Tell your WH that if he wants to make up his own rules, he should go create his own league.

[Suudy]

Thanks for all the responses. It is only this one WH that I've worked with (we rotate crews every week) that has done this. But what really got me on the DOG for being out of timeouts was that the rest of the crew disagreed with me. I know it is in the NFHS Rules by Topic book, and I plan to show it to him at our next meeting.

Again, I feel for the teams that get the wrong rulings during the season, then go to the playoffs and get the correct ruling. I've been in post-season situations where the coach is asking me why something is being called when it wasn't called all season. That's my biggest frustration.

[FeetBallRef]

Originally Posted by Suudy

...Again, I feel for the teams that get the wrong rulings during the season, then go to the playoffs and get the correct ruling. I've been in post-season situations where the coach is asking me why something is being called when it wasn't called all season. That's my biggest frustration.

The lack of consistent rules knowledge at the HS level is one of the biggest problems that we face. There doesn't appear to be a method to get that problem fixed either.

HS officials just don't appear to care enough to learn the rules.

[sloth]

...on the issue of 12 men breaking the huddle, I've had this fight with several other officials...some of which I would say are excellent officials. Some just can't accept the discression the white hat is given by the federation over the NCAA. In fact I have simply given up trying to educate others. When I wear the white hat, I call it the right way; when I'm not, I let it go and don't say a word.

My issues is and always has been that the federation allows the referee the discression to decide when the replaced player has stayed on the field too long. There is the discression to allow an inexperienced player to linger a little longer if he doesn't realize that he should have already left the field. The NCAA statute gives a very solid, concret measure for illegal substitution. While I agree that breaking the huddle with 12 players should alert the referee to pay attendtion that no advantage is being gained , it in NOT an automatic foul as in NCAA.