Force- Scrimmage, Try and OT

[PaulJak]

A fumbles and the ball is nearly at rest on the B 3 yard line. B applies a new force (let's not debate if its a new force or not, in this situation I've ruled that it is ) that puts that ball into B's endzone. B picks up and possess the ball in the end zone (B is not "down" when he possess is it).

What can happen during:

a) a normal scrimmage down
b) a try
c) OT (normal Fed 10 yard line OT)

[Suudy]

Originally Posted by PaulJak

A fumbles and the ball is nearly at rest on the B 3 yard line. B applies a new force (let's not debate if its a new force or not, in this situation I've ruled that it is ) that puts that ball into B's endzone. B picks up and possess the ball in the end zone (B is not "down" when he possess is it).

What can happen during:

a) a normal scrimmage down
b) a try
c) OT (normal Fed 10 yard line OT)

I'll take a stab.

In a), play is still live. If B runs out of the EZ, spot of the end of the run. If B is downed in the EZ, safety.

In b) and c), ball is dead upon B's possession.

[MD Longhorn]

Isn't b) a 1-point safety and c) a regular safety?

[Suudy]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Isn't b) a 1-point safety and c) a regular safety?

Not in NFHS, at least not for b.

[PaulJak]

You guys got it.

I think its interesting that B doesn't have any opportunity to advance that ball out of the end zone on a try or in OT. Essentially once the ball enters B's end zone they can't do anything to get it out. If a kid picks it up and trys to do anything, A gets points.

In the OT, since A gets two points, now B only needs to kick a FG to win the game, or if B fails on their series, they lose even though A scored only because by rule the ball was declared dead. If that had occurred during regulation B would have been given the opportunity to advance out of their own end zone.

I don't know that I'd call it a loop hole in the rules, but it doesn't seem "fair" to deny B the opportunity to get it out of their own end zone. Does anybody have insight into the philosophy behind this set of rules?

[PaulJak]

Originally Posted by Suudy

Not in NFHS, at least not for b.

Its a 1 point safety for A. A would get a total of 7 points (6 for the touchdown and one for getting a safety on B).

This is not B getting a safety against A (ie., running it back 97 yards)

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by PaulJak

A fumbles and the ball is nearly at rest on the B 3 yard line. B applies a new force (let's not debate if its a new force or not, in this situation I've ruled that it is ) that puts that ball into B's endzone. B picks up and possess the ball in the end zone (B is not "down" when he possess is it).


What can happen during:

a) a normal scrimmage down
b) a try
c) OT (normal Fed 10 yard line OT)

CANADIAN RULING:

1. B can run the ball out of the EZ. If they don't, my interp is that A scores a safety touch.
2. Once B obtains possession on a try (is that an extra point attempt?), the play is over.
3. B can score to win the game.

[Suudy]

Originally Posted by PaulJak

Its a 1 point safety for A. A would get a total of 7 points (6 for the touchdown and one for getting a safety on B).

This is not B getting a safety against A (ie., running it back 97 yards)

Hmmm....the ball becomes dead as soon as B possess the ball. And the ball becomes dead in B's EZ, in B's possession, and the momentum exception is not in effect. I guess I see it that. But since B never gets the chance to do anything with the ball (as you mentioned earlier), seems that A gets the points without any effort of its own. Strange, that's why I thought no safety--ball is just dead.

[andy1033]

a normal play

b 1 pt for A.

c. safety 2pts for A ....... B gets their turn next

[ljdave]

Originally Posted by Suudy

Hmmm....the ball becomes dead as soon as B possess the ball. And the ball becomes dead in B's EZ, in B's possession, and the momentum exception is not in effect. I guess I see it that. But since B never gets the chance to do anything with the ball (as you mentioned earlier), seems that A gets the points without any effort of its own. Strange, that's why I thought no safety--ball is just dead.

Casebook 8-3-3. It's a safety, one point for A.