Dallas vs. Seattle

[mcrowder]

OK, yes --- 99% of the time here, I'm an official. For this thread, call me fanboy if you want.

That said... did you guys see the reviewed pass to Terry Glenn around the 2 yard line? It appeared to me to be a very obvious non-catch. The ball hit his hands, was not controlled, went to the ground, where Glenn used the contact with the ground to retain control (a little - still not sure he really had it even after it hit the ground), and then immediately fumble.

While watching it, I was glad to see the play reviewed. I was not even worried about it - I knew it would be fixed. When the fix turned out to be the change of a TD to a safety (which turned out to be worse for the Boys, actually), I was shocked. I'm not sure when I crossed over from being able to rule objectively on the play, but I definitely don't feel very objective about it right now.

What say you - who saw it, and what did you think?

[Raymond]

I say you were viewing that play through Texas-colored glasses.

My initial thought before seeing the replays was that there was a possibility that the play would be ruled incomplete for the exact reason you stated. But then after the replays I thought it was obvious that Glenn controlled the ball while standing, attempted to tuck the ball away, slipped, his bottom hand hit the turf (left hand I think), and then he got up.

[Time2Ref]

I thought that play was called correctly, after replay.

What I couldn't believe was why did Parcels have Romo as the place kick holder if he wasn't going to fake the field goal? Isn't that the back-up quarterback's job usually?

In the NFL, can they attempt a field goal on 3rd down and again on 4th down if it misses?

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Time2Ref

In the NFL, can they attempt a field goal on 3rd down and again on 4th down if it misses?

They changed the rule a few years ago. It used to be if you kicked prior to 4th down and it was blocked and the K-team recovered behind the LOS they could continue with their series. Now, once they attempt their kick, they lose their series of downs, unless of course, someone pulls a Leon Lett in which case it's treated like a muffed punt.

[cmathews]

Romo, was the holder because he started the season as the backup qb, which as was pointed out above is usually the holder.....even more unusual than having the starting qb be the holder (1 team this year...the broncos while plummer was starting) is changing the holder in the middle of the year, thus romo as the holder......if this play had occured on 3rd down, they would have had the opportunity to try it again as there was no legal kick attempted

[stevesmith]

Why is no one questioning the review of the spot near the 1 yard line? Has anyone ever seen a review of a quarterback sneak that is within inches of reaching the line to gain? The camera angles just aren't that perfect to make those determinations. In this case, I think they probably got the call right, but I do have a problem with the use of replay in that situation.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

OK, yes --- 99% of the time here, I'm an official. For this thread, call me fanboy if you want.

More like whineboy.

Backcourt Violation - Mavs Heat

Nothing changes with you. 99% of the time you're a fanboy. 1% of the time you're an official. If a Dallas team loses, it's the officials' fault.

[Texas Aggie]

If a Dallas team loses, it's the officials' fault.

Can you please point out where in this or the one other thread you referenced that said anything about a loss being the officials' fault?

[bisonlj]

NFL officials use a mechanic (and our FED crew is now using it as well) where they start a new set of downs with the nose of the ball touching a yard line. With the perfect lines on an NFL field you can be guaranteed of judgement without measurements if the nose of the ball is reaching the line to gain.

If that was the case here, the crew knew the ball had to reach the 1 to be a first down. I thought the same thing as BadNewsRef. He was pretty much straight-up with the ball in the arm furthest from the end zone and his feet never crossed the one. What this tells you is he never reached the line to gain. Whether it's 1 inch or 18 inches from the line is irrelevant. He was still short.

That being said, I thought it was pretty bold of the referee to overturn the spot. That was a very big spot in a very big game and you had better be 110% certain the spot was wrong. I guess it actually helped Dallas in a strange way. Had they given him the first down, they would have run the clock down to 4 seconds left and missed the field goal (assuming the same misfortune for TR) with no chance for a Hail Mary at the end. Terry Glenn was open at the back of the end zone and any tip would have resulted in a TD and win for Dallas. Just an odd twist to the play. What an amazing finish! I feel for your mcrowder.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie

Can you please point out where in this or the one other thread you referenced that said anything about a loss being the officials' fault?

Iirc correctly, there were a couple of other Mavericks fans whining about the officials too. Guess who?

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Iirc correctly, there were a couple of other Mavericks fans whining about the officials too. Guess who?

Coming on here to ask for impartial thoughts from this group regarding officiating in a game where we feel we may not be impartial does not mean we are "blaming a loss on the officials". Far from it. I could name 10 reasons the Cowboys lost the Seattle game, and would never mention anything about the officiating. I could name 5 other reasons they are out of the playoffs (meaning ... reasons they were playing the Seahawks in the first place instead of sitting at home watching Philly play Seattle).

I simply wondered how the impartial official saw the play. I certainly am not going to get an impartial view at the water cooler around here. I thought the officials did a great job in the game, to be honest (as usual for the NFL). I just wanted to hear national thoughts on the play I had a question on.

[Texas Aggie]

Can you please point out where in this or the one other thread you referenced that said anything about a loss being the officials' fault?

JR: did your most recent post attempt to answer this question?

If so, it didn't. Can you please try again?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie

Can you please point out where in this or the one other thread you referenced that said anything about a loss being the officials' fault?

Backcourt Violation - Mavs Heat

See the post from June 22, 2006 @ 3:01pm.

"Yes I'm from Dallas and I'm a Maverick fan".

"But this series was just bad. Your defense of these very one-sided mistakes is simply either blind obedience or just stupid stubborness. Refusal to recognize what are obviously bad calls doesn't help anyone"

"Surely at a minimum, you "experts" in the field can at least recognize that in this particular case, the inevitable mistakes did happen to go the Heat's way more than it's FAIR SHARE".

"Bad"? "Very one-sided mistakes"? "Obviously bad calls"? "Go the Heat's way more than it's fair share"? And all this is from a guy that's supposed to be a devoted football and baseball umpire but admits that he has never officiated a basketball game in his life and doesn't know the rules.

I can track some more down if you want. I can also dig up some quotes from some other Dallas fanboys too.

If you fanboys want to crap on the officials, hey, be my guest. Just don't intimate that you've got more credibility because you happen to officiate a sport. You don't. You're fanboys first and officials second.

That's my point, like it or not.

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Backcourt Violation - Mavs Heat

See the post from June 22, 2006 @ 3:01pm.

"Yes I'm from Dallas and I'm a Maverick fan".

"But this series was just bad. Your defense of these very one-sided mistakes is simply either blind obedience or just stupid stubborness. Refusal to recognize what are obviously bad calls doesn't help anyone"

"Surely at a minimum, you "experts" in the field can at least recognize that in this particular case, the inevitable mistakes did happen to go the Heat's way more than it's FAIR SHARE".

"Bad"? "Very one-sided mistakes"? "Obviously bad calls"? "Go the Heat's way more than it's fair share"? And all this is from a guy that's supposed to be a devoted football and baseball umpire but admits that he has never officiated a basketball game in his life and doesn't know the rules.

I can track some more down if you want. I can also dig up some quotes from some other Dallas fanboys too.

If you fanboys want to crap on the officials, hey, be my guest. Just don't intimate that you've got more credibility because you happen to officiate a sport. You don't. You're fanboys first and officials second.

That's my point, like it or not.

You're an idiot. Other nouns come to mind as well, but are not fit for this forum. Adjectives do as well - I'll leave them to your imagination.

THIS post was intended to try to get an unbiased opinion on a play that bothered me - from a fan's point of view. I completely admitted that I was likely biased, and in fact it was that bias that led me to try to get an impartial viewpoint from folks I respect (a group that most pointedly does not include you).

In the basketball posts, again, I fully admit that not only was I a biased fan WRT that particular game, but also that I was not an official of that sport, and was wanting to discuss what I saw as an injustice with people who I admit probably knew better than I. But even in that thread (where I did and still do feel like (intent or not --- probably not) the bulk of the questionable calls went in one direction), I never stated (or felt, or thought) that the "refs cost us the game." The Mavs lost that series because they got cocky and complacent. Period. But if you could watch that particular series objectively (you can't... for some reason, the fact that you are an official in 3 sports leads you to believe that no official anywhere ever makes a mistake), then you should be able to admit that the documented mistaken calls DID, in fact, go more against one team than the other. It's unfortunate, but it happens. The statement you quote above was in rebuttal to one of your many absurd posts saying that anyone who ever had the temerity to even mildly disagree with even a single call was a blind fool.

I tire of your idiocy. You spread it across 3 boards. At least you're consistent - you are a moron on all 3. Always have been. You contribute nothing. You never post anything constructive. You're sole purpose seems to be starting fights. Now I finally find a use for the ignore feature if I can get it working. I'm done with you.

Anyone wishing to contribute to the discussion, please do so. I asked an honest question. Until JR derailed the discussion (as per usual), I got honest answers from people whose opinions I've come to respect, and I thank you all for that.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

You're an idiot.

I might be an idiot, but I'm an idiot with some integrity.

'Nuff said, fanboy.