2 Plays

[MJT]

Just watched the videos and here is my take.

No foul in play 1. He is engaged at 2 yards and his forward momentum takes him to 2.5 yards after the D-lineman gets by him. This is why it is critical to see the whole play. We have a the same problem when we work 3-man for MS games in that the U has to drop back when there is a pass instead of stepping up to the LOS.

No foul in play #2. It looks to me as if although the blocker puts his head down, the initial contact is above the waist and then he slides down. This is a 15 yard penalty and you had better be sure if you are going to call it.
Remember, the "when in doubt" guideline for "block above or below the waist" is "above the waist."

[Theisey]

Originally Posted by MJT

.... This is a 15 yard penalty and you had better be sure if you are going to call it.
Remember, the "when in doubt" guideline for "block above or below the waist" is "above the waist."

Agree you have to see the whole thing. And of course you only get one shot at it. (unless of course your brain has a replay option for a couple of milliseconds )

Actually the when in doubt for a block below the waist is that it "is below the waist". (source below)
I had some doubts on this play, reviewed the play twice but stayed with my original call that it was below the waist.

The Redding book for NFHS lists many more WID statements than the NCAA formally does, but in both cases they are the same for this block.

[MJT]

I wonder where I had it is "above" IIDoubt? I had it in some of my notes. I have Redding, but didn't look in it.

[UmpJM]

MJT & Theisy,

From the 2004 and 2005 NFHS Football Officials Manual, p.84:

Guides For - When In Question
...

• Block above or below the waist...............................above

Pardon my ignorance, but what is "The Redding book"?

JM

[FootballRef05]

Where the cnfusion may be coming from is with regard to blocking in the back. The reul book stated "when the contact is ruled to be from behind, and the official has question as to the initial point of contact, it shall be ruled clipping".

[Theisey]

Originally Posted by CoachJM

MT & Theisy,

From the 2004 and 2005 NF HS Football Officials Manual, p.84:

Guides For - When In Question
...

• Block above or below the waist...............................above

Pardon my ignorance, but what is "The Redding book"?

JM

Coach... it's TheisEy...

Redding guide is a study guide published for both NCAA and NFHS football rules. It is not a rule book. While the authors says it is not a teaching manual, one can learn a lot from the detailed discussion and case plays they give to many of the rules. Not sure when the NFHS book was first published, maybe 2000, but the NCAA version has been around since at least 1993.

Well, there is apparently a conflict between the Officials manual and the Redding guide. One would say you have to believe the NF publication. I don't. Because this is one of those "safety" type fouls and normally is not permitted in the NF rules, I go with the NCAA version and this guide which as stated says when in doubt the contact is below the waist.

So MJT, you are not really wrong if your source was the officials manual.

[MJT]

Originally Posted by Theisey

Coach... it's TheisEy...



So MJT, you are not really wrong if your source was the officials manual.

I figured I typed it up from somewhere.

Since in college ball, if it was a BBW, it would be legal, I'd say it is less a safety issue than a clip where the codes line up in a downfield clip being illegal.

[Theisey]

There are many times when a BBW is illegal (NCAA) such as after any change of team possession, during a kick down, during a scrimmage down and you did it do an eligible receiver, a team-A player in position to receive backwards pass behind the NZ, team-A players 7 yards outside the middle lineman blocking towards the original position of the bali up to 10 yards beyond the NZ, same goes for backs.

When in doubt there, it is below the waist.