NFHS Penalty Announcement

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ajmc

I can appreciate the benefit of letting a Coach know specifically what the nature of the USC foul was, as well as who committed it, so he/she might be in a better position to correct such damaging behavior and prevent it from reoccurring.

How THAT Coach decides to deal with the situation, is up to THAT Coach.

Why does a spectator need that information? What can he/she do with it. Perhaps a parent should know, that seems a decision better made by THAT Coach, who may understand the family dynamics a lot better.

Presuming that EVERY SINGLE UNC foul committed is a MISTAKE (by that player - no excuses, no pay back) as a lack of control and focus, what good does it do to point out THAT player's MISTAKE to a lot of strangers? What's the point?

If the player is ejected or there is something that might result in ejection, then that should be made public. I do not see what "let the coach handle it" has anything to do with the situation. As stated in other sports it is clear when a player is ejected, why not football?

For the record most of the time, we never get a mic in the first place. So this really is not that much of a concern honestly either way.

Peace

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If the player is ejected or there is something that might result in ejection, then that should be made public. I do not see what "let the coach handle it" has anything to do with the situation.

For the record most of the time, we never get a mic in the first place. So this really is not that much of a concern honestly either way. Peace

When a player has been ejected, the situation HAS BEEN HANDLED, any subsequent "handling" by the Coach should be efforts at preventing such behavior from happening AGAIN.

If action, "that might result in ejection" actually HAPPENS, somebody should be ejected, as that penalty is reserved for egregious, or repetitive serious behaviors.

In either event, why does Joe Spectator NEED to know the details? The result unfolding should be all that is necessary to understand the type behavior exhibited.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ajmc

When a player has been ejected, the situation HAS BEEN HANDLED, any subsequent "handling" by the Coach should be efforts at preventing such behavior from happening AGAIN.

If action, "that might result in ejection" actually HAPPENS, somebody should be ejected, as that penalty is reserved for egregious, or repetitive serious behaviors.

In either event, why does Joe Spectator NEED to know the details? The result unfolding should be all that is necessary to understand the type behavior exhibited.

Joe Spectator knows when a player has been given a technical foul in basketball. Joe Spectator knows when a player has been ejected in baseball and softball. Don't players get carded in soccer? Why would we not tell everyone just in football when a penalty has been given to a player or coach for that matter?

Peace

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Joe Spectator knows when a player has been given a technical foul in basketball. Joe Spectator knows when a player has been ejected in baseball and softball. Don't players get carded in soccer? Why would we not tell everyone just in football when a penalty has been given to a player or coach for that matter? Peace

Forgive me, I forgot why I should care what baseball, softball, soccer or basketball does about disqualified players. In football Joe Spectator doesn't need to know the player's identity, it doesn't matter if Joe Spectator knows, or doesn't know the player's identity, and football players don't deserve any notoriety for being really stupid & hurting their team.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by ajmc

I can appreciate the benefit of letting a Coach know specifically what the nature of the USC foul was, as well as who committed it, so he/she might be in a better position to correct such damaging behavior and prevent it from reoccurring.

How THAT Coach decides to deal with the situation, is up to THAT Coach.

Why does a spectator need that information?

Heck, why do they need seating, a scoreboard, a hot dog vendor, or even to be allowed near the game?

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Heck, why do they need seating, a scoreboard, a hot dog vendor, or even to be allowed near the game?

They might get tired of standing, would like to know who's actually playing (corresponds with all the players wearing unique numbers), avoids having to leave their seat if they get hungry, football is a spectator sport.

Perhaps you could suggest a valid reason why a spectator needs to know the identity of a disqualified player AT THE INTERSCHOLASTIC LEVEL.

[scrounge]

Well , just like you admit that they want to know who's playing , they also want to know who committed the foul. And the powers that be have agreed to give that information to them .

[SC Official]

I can't believe some people are so worried about the fragile egos of high school football players that they believe something as trivial as as announcing their number would be harmful to them.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by SC Official

I can't believe some people are so worried about the fragile egos of high school football players that they believe something as trivial as as announcing their number would be harmful to them.

This. Exactly this.


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[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by ajmc

They might get tired of standing, would like to know who's actually playing (corresponds with all the players wearing unique numbers), avoids having to leave their seat if they get hungry, football is a spectator sport.

Perhaps you could suggest a valid reason why a spectator needs to know the identity of a disqualified player AT THE INTERSCHOLASTIC LEVEL.

They don't need to know that. They don't need to be there at all. The game doesn't need to be played. Football isn't a necessity.

But they may want to know, for the same reason they want to sit & be spectators, & the same reason people want to play AT THE INTERSCHOLASTIC LEVEL.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ajmc

They might get tired of standing, would like to know who's actually playing (corresponds with all the players wearing unique numbers), avoids having to leave their seat if they get hungry, football is a spectator sport.

Perhaps you could suggest a valid reason why a spectator needs to know the identity of a disqualified player AT THE INTERSCHOLASTIC LEVEL.

Because they do it at every other level and most sports. When a player is penalized for some unsporting act, usually it is announced publicly and usually, penalties are a result.

Basketball not only are the players to have announced to have a technical foul, there are actual actions that show a technical foul was likely given. In soccer, you give a red card when a player is ejected. In baseball or softball, play likey stops when there is an unsporting act and the player might immediately leave the contest as a result (like arguing balls and strikes) and under the right circumstances is replaced by another batter (if that is still the rule). I even believe in Volleyball there are players given cards. In hockey, there is a penalty box. So football has to be different? And we are in a much larger space where literally the announcers might not even know what took place but the signal for unsportsmanlike conduct. How many times have I given a block in the back signal only to have the announcer say "holding."

Also, I had a playoff game this where a kid from both teams was ejected for their second UNC foul with no mic. They conference assignor was asked by a coach who was ejected from the contest that they were playing the next week. Maybe if we had a mic to announce this, there would have been little confusion on the video. Because by IHSA By-Laws a player ejected must sit the next game, an announcement might have helped the confusion. And yes we had to tell the coaches, but it took longer than needed.

Peace

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Because they do it at every other level and most sports. When a player is penalized for some unsporting act, usually it is announced publicly and usually, penalties are a result.

. How many times have I given a block in the back signal only to have the announcer say "holding."

Also, I had a playoff game this where a kid from both teams was ejected for their second UNC foul with no mic. They conference assignor was asked by a coach who was ejected from the contest that they were playing the next week. Maybe if we had a mic to announce this, there would have been little confusion on the video. Because by IHSA By-Laws a player ejected must sit the next game, an announcement might have helped the confusion. And yes we had to tell the coaches, but it took longer than needed.

Peace

I'm still looking for, "a valid reason why a spectator needs to know the identity of a disqualified player AT THE INTERSCHOLASTIC LEVEL." at a football game. Why also should I care how other sports handle this question.

As for the playoff game information; the conference assignor should have known the answer to that Coach's question, or the Coach should have asked one of the game officials. Are you suggesting Referee's should also announce each rule, that explains each penalty?

"Because everyone else does it", is not usually a good answer.

[CT1]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Also, I had a playoff game this where a kid from both teams was ejected for their second UNC foul with no mic. They conference assignor was asked by a coach who was ejected from the contest that they were playing the next week.

In English, please.......

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by ajmc

I'm still looking for, "a valid reason why a spectator needs to know the identity of a disqualified player AT THE INTERSCHOLASTIC LEVEL." at a football game.

So you're asking why something that is not needed should be done? Are you unclear about separate existence of desires from needs? Were you under the impression that everything else about a football game, including the game itself, is a necessity?

People play & watch games because they like it, even though they don't need it. The only reason officials are there is to serve the desires of these people regarding what they like, not what they need. They don't need football, they don't need officials. However, people watching football (at any level) might like this piece of info about penalties. Why are you averse to making them happier?

Most of the football I'm used to has no specators, or hardly any. However, I recognize that there are games that do attract them. I used to like going to watch games too. There are accommodations in many places to the desires fo such spectators, as discussed upthread. Why should interscholastic football be an exception to such accommodations?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ajmc

I'm still looking for, "a valid reason why a spectator needs to know the identity of a disqualified player AT THE INTERSCHOLASTIC LEVEL." at a football game. Why also should I care how other sports handle this question.

"Valid" is a value judgment and subjective. If you cannot accept what was said, then do not accept the explanations given to you. The bottom line is that the people that make the decisions decided that we announce the numbers. It really does not matter if it is valid to you or even me one way or the other. You also do not have to accept what other sports do, but so you know the NF often has rules that are similar in other sports. We know that in their process of rules and mechanics changes, these changes are reviewed by other committee members in other sports. So if basketball, for example, announces fouls and warnings to specific players, then I am sure it was hard to justify why we would not announce such unsporting act in football. And every other level of football announces penalties with numbers.

Originally Posted by ajmc

As for the playoff game information; the conference assignor should have known the answer to that Coach's question, or the Coach should have asked one of the game officials. Are you suggesting Referee's should also announce each rule, that explains each penalty?

"Because everyone else does it", is not usually a good answer.

I do not know that he should have known, but if he asked I have the ability to tell him. I know that assignor very well and gave the appropriate information to him. We worked a State Final together, no sweat off my back either way. I do not know the coach so why would the coach ask me? Fellow officials watch games they are not working all the time and often are asked opinions about things that happen. If a coach that I do not know contacts me about something in a game that he was not at, I probably would not respond as I have no allegiance to him/her. I know the assignor/fellow official and I told him what he wanted to know. It was not a secret.

Peace