ACC Championship Offside Call

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by jTheUmp

Because it's a still frame.

If you actually watch the video, you will see that there's a 4th player who is directly behind the player visible at the top of the screen. It's just freaky how he managed to be directly behind the player at that exact instant.

If there were only three on that side of the kick, that means there's only 10 players in the kick formation, and I don't think there's an R in existence in NCAA football who would blow the RFP on a free kick if one team only had 10 players on the field.

The video is clear. They had 4 on each side. My mistake. If the penalty was actually an illegal formation, then he thought he saw it that way, but why would he throw the flag for that when it was on the opposite side of the field. Seems like he just flat out missed the offside.

[HLin NC]

I went to bed Saturday night because it appeared that all the teams in the lead appeared to have it in the bag, save Iowa.

I've perused the Raleigh News And Observer for two days and very little mention of it after a small initial article. They went bonkers after the Duke loss to Miami and Carolina is THE school so apparently the hubbub isn't that big a deal.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by OKREF

The video is clear. They had 4 on each side. My mistake. If the penalty was actually an illegal formation, then he thought he saw it that way, but why would he throw the flag for that when it was on the opposite side of the field. Seems like he just flat out missed the offside.

I was wondering the same thing as I did not see the game. But since it appears that this was an offsides call, it was clearly not right.

Peace

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by OKREF

I don't think they had four on each side when the kick took place.

Yes this is a still frame, but pretty evident they were in an illegal formation.

I see 4 (look at the shadows - there's a player directly behind the top player).

[Dakota]

The rule is breaking the plane, right? I have not seen a camera angle that absolutely could not be suffering from parallax issues... nothing straight down the line. If anything did break the plane, it was most likely #30's fingers, but none of the on-line replay videos that I can find (besides not being at the correct angle) allow for a frame-by-frame look.

[BktBallRef]

There were at least four on each side. Count the players at the top of the screen after the kick. Clearly four players moving behind the kicker.

ACC refs ruin UNC’s chance to upset Clemson

[Suudy]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

It's been that way about 110 yrs. Previously it'd been foot position.

I mean with regard to onside situations, which seems to be the distinction the ACC official is making. Seems a ticky-tacky cop out to me.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by HLin NC

I went to bed Saturday night because it appeared that all the teams in the lead appeared to have it in the bag, save Iowa.

I've perused the Raleigh News And Observer for two days and very little mention of it after a small initial article. They went bonkers after the Duke loss to Miami and Carolina is THE school so apparently the hubbub isn't that big a deal.

Not surprising. You don't find much about Carolina in the N&O anymore unless the words "NCAA investigation" are also included.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by OKREF

The video is clear. They had 4 on each side. My mistake. If the penalty was actually an illegal formation, then he thought he saw it that way, but why would he throw the flag for that when it was on the opposite side of the field. Seems like he just flat out missed the offside.

^. I already corrected myself.

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I see 4 (look at the shadows - there's a player directly behind the top player).

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Suudy

I mean with regard to onside situations, which seems to be the distinction the ACC official is making. Seems a ticky-tacky cop out to me.

We always treat onside situations as an absolute plane. On deep kickoffs, they're fine unless a foot lands offside before the ball is kicked.

That said, I can't see how anyone could possibly be offside based on the screen shots I've seen, even accounting for parallax issues.

[Just4Kicks]

NCAA rules, RULE 6, Section 1, Article 2.c.5:

All players of Team A must have been between the nine-yard marks
after the ready-for-play signal [S19].

Take another look at the video, only don't make the mistake others have made in considering it a violation of the 4-men-per-side rule, which draws everyone's attention away from the actual infraction by focusing attention on the upper part of the screen. Instead, focus on the lower part of the screen, and you will see that the closest player to the near side of the field in the video is lined up outside the hash marks, in violation of this rule.

Now I'm no expert on what the call technically should be for this violation, i.e., whether that is still called an offsides infraction, or perhaps illegal formation or something else. But the official got it right, he was looking right at him when he threw the flag. At worst, he would be guilty of calling it by the wrong name, not making a bad call.

But I'm guessing that the call would still be offside rather than illegal formation, because the infraction is basically the same thing that happens with the normal offside call, it simply involves being offside in regard to the width of the field rather than the length.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Just4Kicks

NCAA rules, RULE 6, Section 1, Article 2.c.5:

All players of Team A must have been between the nine-yard marks
after the ready-for-play signal [S19].

Take another look at the video, only don't make the mistake others have made in considering it a violation of the 4-men-per-side rule, which draws everyone's attention away from the actual infraction by focusing attention on the upper part of the screen. Instead, focus on the lower part of the screen, and you will see that the closest player to the near side of the field in the video is lined up outside the hash marks, in violation of this rule.

Now I'm no expert on what the call technically should be for this violation, i.e., whether that is still called an offsides infraction, or perhaps illegal formation or something else. But the official got it right, he was looking right at him when he threw the flag. At worst, he would be guilty of calling it by the wrong name, not making a bad call.

Except that's not what he was calling -- articles have clearly said what was called and why.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by Rich

Except that's not what he was calling -- articles have clearly said what was called and why.

Holy cow, is it possible an "article" may actually have gotten details WRONG?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Holy cow, is it possible an "article" may actually have gotten details WRONG?

I am starting to wonder the same thing as the media often goes off and tangents about things with rules when they clearly do not have all the details or never seem to talk to people that would know.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Holy cow, is it possible an "article" may actually have gotten details WRONG?

No.

"Offsides is not a reviewable play,” the ACC said in a statement. “The officiating team saw a member of the kicking team break the plane (of the 35-yard line) before the ball was kicked.”

Why don't you stop thinking that officials can't make mistakes? It ruins our credibility. Sometimes you just have to look in the mirror and say, "I made a mistake."