Geno Likes A High School Shot Clock ...

[IUgrad92]

Originally Posted by Bad Zebra

The bottom line is this...A shot clock is a significant fundamental change to the high school game. It would have a significant financial impact to all high schools across the country (equipment) and a significant impact on the officiating, in terms of additional rules knowledge and play-calling skills required to administer correctly.

Other than Geno (whom I'm a big fan of), I haven't heard a lot from college coaches bemoaning the fact that HS players are unprepared for the challenge of a shot clock.

I really don't see this changing any time soon.

My state utilizes the shot clock for HS. Girls were first and boys followed a few years later. Our local AAU organization also utilizes the shot clock down to the 7th and 8th grade levels.

I never heard of even the smallest and most rural high schools eliminating any sport programs due to the implementation costs. In addition, our first/second/third year officials do the majority of the 7th/8th grade AAU games and are handling the officiating duties quite well, including shot clock administration. Now getting table personnel to properly manage the shot clock can be a different story!

I understand the thought of adding a shot clock may seem overwhelming in many different aspects, but I'm not sure realistically if those concerns would truly pan out to have the impacts you are imagining.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

My state utilizes the shot clock for HS. Girls were first and boys followed a few years later. Our local AAU organization also utilizes the shot clock down to the 7th and 8th grade levels.

I never heard of even the smallest and most rural high schools eliminating any sport programs due to the implementation costs. In addition, our first/second/third year officials do the majority of the 7th/8th grade AAU games and are handling the officiating duties quite well, including shot clock administration. Now getting table personnel to properly manage the shot clock can be a different story!

I understand the thought of adding a shot clock may seem overwhelming in many different aspects, but I'm not sure realistically if those concerns would truly pan out to have the impacts you are imagining.

It really comes down to the fact that there's no problem in HS basketball that would be solved by a shot clock.

And regarding the cost: school funds are finite, money spent on a shot clock would have been spent elsewhere.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Adam

And regarding the cost: school funds are finite, money spent on a shot clock would have been spent elsewhere.

Delay the replacement of uniforms for one season and you've got yourself a shot clock.

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Paying someone to run it over a period of twenty games each season? That's another story.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Delay the replacement of uniforms for one season and you've got yourself a shot clock.

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Paying someone to run it over a period of twenty games each season? That's another story.

Someone competent to run it. I have run into enough problems in my college games.

And partners who will know WTF the rules are in regards to the shot clock at the HS level.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Someone competent to run it. And partners who will know WTF the rules are in regards to the shot clock at the HS level.

Connecticut only uses a shot clock for private prep school games at the varsity level, not at lower level games. Even though I review the shot clock rules before each private prep school game that I work, I always hope that my partner is a college official.

It doesn't help that the shot clock operator is usually a student, and is often female student for a boys game. Her secondary job is to operate the shot clock after her primary job of flirting with the cute prep school boys.

[IUgrad92]

Originally Posted by Adam

It really comes down to the fact that there's no problem in HS basketball that would be solved by a shot clock.

And regarding the cost: school funds are finite, money spent on a shot clock would have been spent elsewhere.

I wonder what the average cost was to lay down 3 point lines and what problem existed so that it had to be implemented? I'm guessing there wasn't much resistance to that particular change.

Point is, as past has shown, sometimes things are implemented regardless.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

I wonder what the average cost was to lay down 3 point lines and what problem existed so that it had to be implemented? I'm guessing there wasn't much resistance to that particular change.

Point is, as past has shown, sometimes things are implemented regardless.

I am sure a 3 point line was a lot easier to add than a shot clock. And a shot clock that works properly and is easy to use.

Again, I would never cost is the only issue. I just think that it takes another level of game awareness to use that device and to catch mistakes. As stated, I see enough mistakes at the lower level college level. And the good teams that I see, do not often need a shot clock anyway. What I think we might see is more forced shots or bad shots because there is a shot clock. I still see scores in the 30s in many cases because not all high school teams can shoot.

Peace

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

I wonder what the average cost was to lay down 3 point lines and what problem existed so that it had to be implemented? I'm guessing there wasn't much resistance to that particular change.

How much does it cost to pay a three point line operator and how often do the lines need to be maintained?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Welpe

... how often do the lines need to be maintained?

Back when I was coaching middle school basketball, the gymnasium floor would be stripped, sanded, lines repainted, and varnished, every several years, or so. And, if I remember correctly, it wasn't cheap. The floor was simple revarnished every year, or so.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Back when I was coaching middle school basketball, the gymnasium floor would be stripped, sanded, lines repainted, and varnished, every several years, or so. And, if I remember correctly, it wasn't cheap. The floor was simple revarnished every year, or so.

But that was and is being done regardless of adding new lines. For a lot of courts the lbs could have been added at a normal repaint time.

[NDRef]

I referee in North Dakota and we have had a shot clock (10 years) for quite few years (we also adopted the 3 point line in the 1982-83 basketball season...as you can imagine ND hasn't had a voice on the NF rules committee for quite some time). It started with our bigger school classification and is now implemented for both divisions (yes, we are that small and have only 2 classes of basketball).

I agree with both Pantherdreams and JRuts original comments on the issue.

As an official (and a parent), this is what I have experienced:

1) Games are much more enjoyable to work. Constant action is dictated by the shot clock and coaches have adjusted.

2) More kids are playing and therefore coaches are developing and spending more time with kids. Even the smallest schools are better at developing players because the constant action requires deeper benches. Historically, we saw teams with shallow benches slow play down to help keep their players fresh.

3) I officiated college basketball for 20 years and the number of problems with shot clock operators at the varsity level isn't a whole lot different than the small college level. We use the shot clock in subvarsity contests (soph and JV) and just like we train players, coaches, timers, and scorers....shot clock operators learn the trade as well at this level.

4) In my opinion, the shot clock has made the game different and for the better. I also live in a border city and our group covers Minnesota as well. Most of us would like to see Minnesota adapt the shot clock....it is more fun to officiate.

5) The vast majority of our games are covered with 3 officials....primarily because the coaches and administrators saw the need with the additional constant action both offensively and defensively.

6) The initial resistance due to cost was relatively short-lived, as it was seen that the benefits far outweighed the negatives. Around here it meant that a team delayed new uniform purchases for 1 year.

Just some thoughts from a guy who has lived and continues to live both worlds. The game of high school basketball is fine either way, no right or wrong...it is just my opinion that the games are more fun work and more kids are being developed and playing. We are here to make our game the best that it can be, I don't care if that benefits the college game or not...only interested in the impact on our game.

PS

North Dakota also implemented the Restricted Arc this year for our bigger shcools. I, personally, was not a big fan in the beginning. But, I was proven wrong....absolutely loved it, coaches loved it, and the players loved it. Really improved the game under the basket....I didn't think high school kids could adjust, but I was wrong. It is here to stay in our small part of the world.