2.10.1 Situation L - but in reverse

[Rich1]

Had the following this week:

I am at C and call blocking foul on V, staying with the action all the way to the floor. Since I did not see the ball go in I asked T if basket was good. He says no. I report the foul and award two shots. After the first shot (missed) I hear V coach ask "why is he getting another one if it went in" and at about the exact same time the H coach is saying "hey, we didn't get our two points". I call crew together and apparently neither the T or L actually looked up to watch the ball. Since both coaches agree the basket was good, the R consults the scorer to verify that he saw the ball go in and then decided based on all of the information available to award the basket. Using the table helped the R ultimately get the call right.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Rich1

Had the following this week:

I am at C and call blocking foul on V, staying with the action all the way to the floor. Since I did not see the ball go in I asked T if basket was good. He says no. I report the foul and award two shots. After the first shot (missed) I hear V coach ask "why is he getting another one if it went in" and at about the exact same time the H coach is saying "hey, we didn't get our two points". I call crew together and apparently neither the T or L actually looked up to watch the ball. Since both coaches agree the basket was good, the R consults the scorer to verify that he saw the ball go in and then decided based on all of the information available to award the basket. Using the table helped the R ultimately get the call right.

The problem in this play was that your Trail told you "no" when he actually wasn't aware of whether or not the ball went in. Had he simply been honest and said, "I don't know" or "I didn't see it" you would have gone through the process of asking these other people BEFORE awarding any FTs and obtained the correct answer before continuing the game. That would have prevented the need to use the AP arrow in the situation in your game. I would be very upset with the Trail and he would hear about it following the game.

[Rich1]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

The problem in this play was that your Trail told you "no" when he actually wasn't aware of whether or not the ball went in. Had he simply been honest and said, "I don't know" or "I didn't see it" you would have gone through the process of asking these other people BEFORE awarding any FTs and obtained the correct answer before continuing the game. That would have prevented the need to use the AP arrow in the situation in your game. I would be very upset with the Trail and he would hear about it following the game.

Agreed. He got caught ball watching as the play transitioned from his area to mine. He acknowledged it at half time.

The H coach wasn't happy that we went to the AP arrow but it was the right procedure since an officials error meant no one rebounded.

[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by Rich1

Agreed. He got caught ball watching as the play transitioned from his area to mine. He acknowledged it at half time.

The H coach wasn't happy that we went to the AP arrow but it was the right procedure since an officials error meant no one rebounded.

Every time a coach points out a mistake I made, I want to ask them about the mistakes they've made as a coach.

[johnny d]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I would be very upset with the Trail and he would hear about it following the game.

Of course he would, God forbid somebody does something to upset you.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by johnny d

Of course he would, God forbid somebody does something to upset you.

Being truthful with my partners, the coaches, and players is of paramount importance to me. I can always forgive honest mistakes, but another official being dishonest or untruthful is definitely going to upset me. Our integrity forms the core of our job description as game officials.

By your post are you saying that you feel differently?

[johnny d]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Being truthful with my partners, the coaches, and players is of paramount importance to me. I can always forgive honest mistakes, but another official being dishonest or untruthful is definitely going to upset me. Our integrity forms the core of our job description as game officials.

By your post are you saying that you feel differently?

No. My post is implying that I can only imagine the ensuing lecture another official would receive because you were upset, rather than a discussion about what happened and how it might have been handled differently.

[Nevadaref]

Please tell all of us how you handle one official lying about something to his partner differently.

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Please tell all of us how you handle one official lying about something to his partner differently.

Are you sure his telling you the ball went in was "a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive"?

[Rich1]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Please tell all of us how you handle one official lying about something to his partner differently.

I would not classify my partners actions as a lie. He saw the ball bounce away at a weird angle and assumed it had bounced off the rim without going in, which he thought was verified by the other ref since he did not question it (he administered the free throws). It was an error and we fixed it. That's all.

[johnny d]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Please tell all of us how you handle one official lying about something to his partner differently.

Lying is such an egregious crime, I would just skip the lecture, blast the guy with a taser, and then finish the game with 2 officials.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

The problem in this play was that your Trail told you "no" when he actually wasn't aware of whether or not the ball went in. Had he simply been honest and said, "I don't know" or "I didn't see it" you would have gone through the process of asking these other people BEFORE awarding any FTs and obtained the correct answer before continuing the game. That would have prevented the need to use the AP arrow in the situation in your game. I would be very upset with the Trail and he would hear about it following the game.

Agreed. If you didn't see it, say that. He put the calling official in a tough spot when it wasn't necessary.