Player equipment question

[Raymond]

I am working games in a national girls Nike tournament being played locally.

It seems that all the girls have been give "Karate Kid" looking Nike headbands with long loose ends. Yesterday, in all 3 games I worked, I had the girls remove them while in the game. IMO, the ends of the headbands are safety hazards because they could poke someone in the eye.

Agree/disagree with my actions? Nothing in 3-5 specifically addresses this type of item, but the rule (or case play) does say the prohibited list is not all inclusive.

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I am working games in a national girls Nike tournament being played locally.

It seems that all the girls have been give "Karate Kid" looking Nike headbands with long loose ends. Yesterday, in all 3 games I worked, I had the girls remove them while in the game. IMO, the ends of the headbands are safety hazards because they could poke someone in the eye.

Agree/disagree with my actions? Nothing in 3-5 specifically addresses this type of item, but the rule (or case play) does say the prohibited list is not all inclusive.

Skylar Diggins I think popularized these "flying tails" style head thingies. Several years ago I insisted they take 'em off. Couldn't come up with a reason that 3" of cloth was any sort of a safety issue, so they seem to be universally allowed around here now. Never had any sort of item at the ends that would poke anything out. With the lack of any specific rule that I can find (am always open to learning if I'm missing something), I don't consider it an issue to bite off. As a fad, it will fade in time, only to be replaced by something else equally as unnecessary.
Anyone else allow or forbid these?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Nike headbands with long loose ends.

Like this?



If so, I don't see anything illegal about this.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

It seems that all the girls have been give "Karate Kid" looking Nike headbands with long loose ends. Yesterday, in all 3 games I worked, I had the girls remove them while in the game. IMO, the ends of the headbands are safety hazards because they could poke someone in the eye.

Could they have been further tied up or tucked in in any way or would that have been too much trouble for what it's worth?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Could they have been further tied up or tucked in in any way or would that have been too much trouble for what it's worth?

Would you ask a player with a long ponytail to further tie it up, or to tuck it in? To take it to an extreme, would you ask a player with totally unrestrained waist length hair not tied back in any way, i.e., no ponytail, to put it into a ponytail?

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Would you ask a player with a long ponytail to further tie it up, or to tuck it in? To take it to an extreme, would you ask a player with totally unrestrained waist length hair not tied back in any way, i.e., no ponytail, to put it into a ponytail?

This appears to be a Nike sponsored contest, with Nike products, I was trying to reach a compromise to allow the players to safely wear them.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Don't be silly, Billy.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

To take it to an extreme ...

I agree, the extreme can be silly.

Originally Posted by grunewar

This appears to be a Nike sponsored contest, with Nike products, I was trying to reach a compromise to allow the players to safely wear them.

If the headbands are the same as the image that I posted earlier, then I don't believe that any compromise is necessary, I believe that these are legal equipment.

While hair is definitely not equipment, it does fall under NFHS safety rulings. Officials can rule that fingernails, also not equipment, are a safety issue, and not allow a player to wear unsafe length fingernails. I doubt that most officials would rule long hair, just because it's long, to be a safety issue, either in a ponytail, or unrestrained. If most officials would deem that long hair wouldn't present any safety issues by "poke(ing) someone in the eye", then most officials would probably not deem that a few inches of cloth on a headband would present any safety concerns.

I am willing to accept that my premise might be wrong, but over thirty-three years, and thousands of games, I've never seen an official remove a player from a game simply because her hair was too long, and thus, unsafe. By rule, we can, but I've never seen long hair, simply because it was too long, be ruled unsafe.

I might (note that I said might) have an issue with long hair tied up into knots at the end, i.e., some type of braiding. These knots, when inertially swung around, could present some "poke(ing)" safety concerns (high school physics, Newton's Second Law, F=ma). But just plain hair, or just plain cloth (on a headband), wouldn't generate the same concern (or Second Law force) for me. Also, obviously, beads on the end of hair, or anywhere, must always be considered illegal.

3.5 SITUATION A: What are the standards which the referee must use in determining whether a team member will be permitted to wear certain equipment? RULING: ... criteria which determine the legality of equipment ... any equipment which, in the judgment of the referee, is dangerous to others ... Equipment which could cut or cause an opponent to have an abrasion is also always illegal and, therefore, is prohibited. It will be noted that the listing of equipment which is always illegal is not inclusive. It cannot identify every item which is not permitted. The generalization is required since the referee’s judgment is necessary.

3-7: The referee shall not permit any team member to participate if in his/her judgment any item constitutes a safety concern, such as, but not limited to, a player’s fingernails or hairstyle.

And most of you guys probably thought that you would never have any real use for high school physics. Now you should all contact your physics teachers and apologize to them. I'm sure that Mr. Letize, my high school physics teacher, and baseball coach, would be pleased that I used a reference to Newton's Laws in a basketball situation. He would always use examples from sports to demonstrate various physics principles.

[Raymond]

There is a women d-1 camp in conjunction with this tournament. I asked one of the observers and she said officials have addressed this but they are still legal as of right now.

[BillyMac]

... they are still legal as of right now.

... and boom goes the dynamite.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

If most officials would deem that long hair wouldn't present any safety issues by "poke(ing) someone in the eye", then most officials would probably not deem that a few inches of cloth on a headband would present any safety concerns.

We're discussing this (below)? Right?

[SAJ]

I thought headbands had to be "unadorned"

[Raymond]

Like this Billy, in regards to how it hangs:

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SAJ

I thought headbands had to be "unadorned"

Beauty, being subjective, is in the eye of the beholder.

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Like this, in regards to how it hangs.

If it were a single, legal, color, I wouldn't think twice about allowing this in my game. It's no more unsafe than "a ponytail hangin' down" and we've all allowed ponytails in our games. I'm tougher than most in enforcing Fashion Police rules, and this wouldn't even make a blip on my radar screen.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Beauty, being subjective, is in the eye of the beholder.



If it were a single, legal, color, I wouldn't think twice about allowing this in my game. It's no more unsafe than "a ponytail hangin' down" and we've all allowed ponytails in our games. I'm tougher than most in enforcing Fashion Police rules, and this wouldn't even make a blip on my radar screen.

I'm not arguing that it's legal, but I will disagree with your ponytail reasoning. That has nothing to do with this.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Beauty, being subjective, is in the eye of the beholder.



If it were a single, legal, color, I wouldn't think twice about allowing this in my game. It's no more unsafe than "a ponytail hangin' down" and we've all allowed ponytails in our games. I'm tougher than most in enforcing Fashion Police rules, and this wouldn't even make a blip on my radar screen.

I now know that the Karate Kid headband is legal.

But since you are making ponytail and headbands equivalent, how long would you let the tail of the headband hang? To the shoulders; mid-back; rear end?

And of course, in a boy's game, would make the same allowances, correct?

[hoopsaddict]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Like this Billy, in regards to how it hangs:

One may argue that 3-5-4b would be used to rule the headband in the photo above illegal as the headband now extends beyond the maximum 2 inches.