The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball
Register FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 12:32pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockyroad View Post
This first play is a great example of why new L's are told to get to the endline and get set up to receive the play. This L actually slows down and is shuffling the last 10 feet or so instead of busting his butt to get down there. As a result, I honestly don't think he even sees the defender coming from the inside to try to block the shot. Had he hustled and got down there and been in position, he might have had a better look at it.

And yes, I know we all get beat at times. This guy didn't get beat, he eased up.

So...could the C have come in with a whistle on that play? You NCAA-M guys can answer that...in an NCAA-W game, I would expect the C to have secondary whistle on that play.
To me it looks like both the L and the C are straight-lined, thus the no call. What if the T comes and gets this? Too much of a reach? Bad blood after the game?
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 01:07pm
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 14,951
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooster View Post
To me it looks like both the L and the C are straight-lined, thus the no call. What if the T comes and gets this? Too much of a reach? Bad blood after the game?
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 01:13pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.
Yes, of course. Duh me...
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 01:44pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 121
Post Driving my wife nuts...

It's these types of sequences that drive me nuts when watching college games (and my verbal spewage leads to my wife being driven nuts too), and also give me an appreciation of why inconsistency in calls drives coaches bananas.

I saw this live and was explaining to my wife about how that sequence of the non-foul and then foul was bad officiating, if for nothing else it was not consistent rulings on back-to-back similar plays.

FWIW - I agree with the "should have been a foul" on the Syracuse defender and "should have been a no call" on the Dayton player.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 03:23pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Missouri
Posts: 671
Quote:
Originally Posted by RefCT View Post
It's these types of sequences that drive me nuts when watching college games (and my verbal spewage leads to my wife being driven nuts too), and also give me an appreciation of why inconsistency in calls drives coaches bananas.

I saw this live and was explaining to my wife about how that sequence of the non-foul and then foul was bad officiating, if for nothing else it was not consistent rulings on back-to-back similar plays.

FWIW - I agree with the "should have been a foul" on the Syracuse defender and "should have been a no call" on the Dayton player.
Exactly. And it was the same guy who no called the Syracuse foul, and then called a block on Dayton when he had a L looking right at it that no called it. I would get reemed on an evaluation for that sequence at the HS level. That is the kind of call that makes a coach lose his mind if the game is big enough, then we have to deal with all of that.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 05:19pm
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
I quit watching after the first foul (the one that wasn't called). I get letting a bit of body contact go when it doesn't create an advantage, but that's not this play.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 05:44pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.
What if he saw the body contact? Is this crew-saver territory? Especially considering the double whammy Syracuse gets on the next play on the other end? Not trying to be argumentative and all, just curious, having most of my experience in two whistles... (For the record my guess: it's not CS territory.)
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 06:30pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: In the offseason.
Posts: 12,263
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
The Trail is looking for goaltending, a hit to the head, or contact to the forearm and wrist on this play. He's going to let the Lead determine body contact.
I don't think the lead had a good angle on that play...in fact it was a poor angle. The trail had the best view through the players here and should come get that if the lead doesn't.
__________________
Owner/Developer of RefTown.com
Commissioner, Portland Basketball Officials Association
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 09:29pm
NFHS Official
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooster View Post
To me it looks like both the L and the C are straight-lined, thus the no call. What if the T comes and gets this? Too much of a reach? Bad blood after the game?
I think this is the right answer. Someone has to get this. Especially since they go to the other end and really, really reach for one there.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 09:43pm
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 14,951
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKREF View Post
I think this is the right answer. Someone has to get this. Especially since they go to the other end and really, really reach for one there.
The travesty is the foul call on the other end. The first play was clearly seen by the Lead and he passed on it. The Trail is trusting his partners' judgment and ref'n his portion of the play, which is the stuff going on at or above the rim. The first play was not a crew-saving call that needed to be made.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Mon Mar 24, 2014, 10:22pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
The travesty is the foul call on the other end. The first play was clearly seen by the Lead and he passed on it. The Trail is trusting his partners' judgment and ref'n his portion of the play, which is the stuff going on at or above the rim. The first play was not a crew-saving call that needed to be made.
Sounds good to me, except this. I do think he passed because he would have been guessing. Everything else is good stuff for me.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Tue Mar 25, 2014, 02:40pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooster
What if he saw the body contact? Is this crew-saver territory? Especially considering the double whammy Syracuse gets on the next play on the other end? Not trying to be argumentative and all, just curious, having most of my experience in two whistles... (For the record my guess: it's not CS territory.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by OKREF View Post
I think this is the right answer. Someone has to get this. Especially since they go to the other end and really, really reach for one there.
So ... the first foul should have been called ESPECIALLY because they knew they were about to call one the other way in the future? Really?
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Tue Mar 25, 2014, 03:19pm
NFHS Official
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
So ... the first foul should have been called ESPECIALLY because they knew they were about to call one the other way in the future? Really?
What I mean is, the first one needs a whistle. But if for whatever reason it is passed on, no way does the second play need a whistle.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Tue Mar 25, 2014, 10:41pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
So ... the first foul should have been called ESPECIALLY because they knew they were about to call one the other way in the future? Really?
OK, I'll play.

So ... you've never had an evaluator at a camp or a supervisor jump your shiza for not making a call, then making a bad call on the other end? Or riding you about calling a travel on A1 and then calling a foul on B1? Or whatever call, that in conjunction with another bad call, made the two plays stand out. What prognostic powers did he have? My turn... Really?
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Wed Mar 26, 2014, 02:21am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 782
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooster View Post
OK, I'll play.

So ... you've never had an evaluator at a camp or a supervisor jump your shiza for not making a call, then making a bad call on the other end? Or riding you about calling a travel on A1 and then calling a foul on B1? Or whatever call, that in conjunction with another bad call, made the two plays stand out. What prognostic powers did he have? My turn... Really?
MD can certainly speak for himself.

I tend to agree with your implication. I find it comical when, with the advantage of hindsight, as in the situation you proposed, an evaluator criticizes actions which were unrelated, except forensically/rhetorically, and post-occurence. It always smacks of the fallacy of the basic scientific method of evaluation - "A exists, and then B exists, therefore A must have caused B." Or, in this case, "therefore, both A and B must be the results of a similar cause."
__________________
To be good at a sport, one must be smart enough to play the game -- and dumb enough to think that it's important . . .
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Jet Man: Video Request for Dayton-Ohio State (Video) Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Basketball 27 Sat Mar 22, 2014 07:27pm
Video Request - Syracuse vs Duke (Video) grunewar Basketball 127 Fri Feb 28, 2014 09:08pm
Syracuse/UM Carter-Williams video request Raymond Basketball 6 Mon Apr 08, 2013 04:13pm
Marq/Syracuse Video please (Video Added) justacoach Basketball 19 Sun Mar 31, 2013 08:50pm
Video Request: Syracuse v. Indiana JRutledge Basketball 23 Fri Mar 29, 2013 09:51am


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:22pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1