Marcus Smart shove - OK State/Texas Tech (Video)

[Texas Aggie]

I have absolutely no love lost for Texas tech or their fans, but I don't believe for a second the fan said anything racial. It would be highly unusual for someone in a public place watching a sporting event that has a much higher percentage of African Americans participating than the normal population and has been that way for decades. I can't tell you the last time I heard the n-word uttered by a non-Black other than a reference to the word itself (i.e. not calling someone the word). That brings up another issue which we don't need to get into, but there were way too many people around for that guy to get away with using such language.

I don't know Smart personally -- he went to HS in the area I worked, but I didn't work any of his games. I do, however, know people who know him. There were some allegations of him moving for athletic purposes (a no-no in Texas) when he was a freshman. That doesn't necessarily make him a bad person or liar, but from what I know about it, given the choice of taking his word or the fan's, I'm probably going to lean toward the fan's.

Bottom line is this: words are not provocation for anything physical. Smart initiated physical contact, so he is clearly in the wrong regardless of what was said. He could be prosecuted for simple assault in Texas. If he's going to have an NBA career that lasts longer than a warm-up, he needs to grow up and realize he will hear all sorts of things said about him, and "piece of crap" will be one of the milder ones.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie

... I can't tell you the last time I heard the n-word uttered by a non-Black other than a reference to the word itself (i.e. not calling someone the word)....

If you live where I live you would hear in malls, high schools, and sport bars...regularly.

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie

...There were some allegations of him moving for athletic purposes (a no-no in Texas) when he was a freshman. That doesn't necessarily make him a bad person or liar, but from what I know about it, given the choice of taking his word or the fan's, I'm probably going to lean toward the fan's.
...

My son is a freshman in high school, last I checked he doesn't have the means to move from one neighborhood to another. That would be something my ex-wife and myself would have control of.

So if my ex-wife or myself decided to move so my son could go to a different school for athletic purposes, that would make my son's version less believable if he were to get into a confrontation?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

If you live where I live you would hear in malls, high schools, and sport bars...regularly.

I'm sorry. Frankly, I hear it so rarely (I'm white, so I'm not going to pretend to understand) that it perks my ears up when I hear it. I've only heard it used once in the course of officiating: one black kid to another black kid trying to provoke a fight on a football field. In that context, I DQ'd the kid. I don't go to sports bars, but the only time I hear it in public is when someone is rapping out loud with his headphones on or between kids using it differently than I ever would, or could.

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

My son is a freshman in high school, last I checked he doesn't have the means to move from one neighborhood to another. That would be something my ex-wife and myself would have control of.

So if my ex-wife or myself decided to move so my son could go to a different school for athletic purposes, that would make my son's version less believable if he were to get into a confrontation?

Exactly. I can't think of anything less relevant for this situation.

[CountTheBasket]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

So if my ex-wife or myself decided to move so my son could go to a different school for athletic purposes, that would make my son's version less believable if he were to get into a confrontation?

Separate from even using it to try and define his character, if I have a son in Texas who is an exceptional MS basketball player, and I want to move three towns over because they have a better HS program, the state of TX tries to say you cannot do that? Did I miss something here...?

[johnny d]

Originally Posted by CountTheBasket

Separate from even using it to try and define his character, if I have a son in Texas who is an exceptional MS basketball player, and I want to move three towns over because they have a better HS program, the state of TX tries to say you cannot do that? Did I miss something here...?

How exactly is the state of TX going to prevent you from selling your old house or letting your lease expire and then buying a new house or signing a new lease in a different town? Once you have moved, if you decide to send your son to a public school doesn't it have to be the one that serves the community you live in?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by johnny d

How exactly is the state of TX going to prevent you from selling your old house or letting your lease expire and then buying a new house or signing a new lease in a different town? Once you have moved, if you decide to send your son to a public school doesn't it have to be the one that serves the community you live in?

Probably why they're only allegations: and completely irrelevant to the issue at hand.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by CountTheBasket

Separate from even using it to try and define his character, if I have a son in Texas who is an exceptional MS basketball player, and I want to move three towns over because they have a better HS program, the state of TX tries to say you cannot do that? Did I miss something here...?

Originally Posted by johnny d

How exactly is the state of TX going to prevent you from selling your old house or letting your lease expire and then buying a new house or signing a new lease in a different town? Once you have moved, if you decide to send your son to a public school doesn't it have to be the one that serves the community you live in?

There are instances of a school / coach / player obtaining an apartment address within the local school district so the athlete can play, even if the "move" is not one we would typically think of.

Just a generic statement, and not making any allegations about any particular situation.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by johnny d

How exactly is the state of TX going to prevent you from selling your old house or letting your lease expire and then buying a new house or signing a new lease in a different town? Once you have moved, if you decide to send your son to a public school doesn't it have to be the one that serves the community you live in?

The burden of proof is on the person moving. There are numerous cases of people moving, being unable to prove they didn't do it for athletics, and finding their kid has to sit a year (or more) from high school athletics. I know one (softball) personally. I also know of one that didn't get challenged and completely got away with it... so they aren't perfect.

[deecee]

So instead of punishing the school districts and or setting strict eligibility rules the state of TX makes a knee jerk policy that effects the kids and the families. The little I know about TX this seems about right.

Guilty until proven innocent.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by deecee

So instead of punishing the school districts and or setting strict eligibility rules the state of TX makes a knee jerk policy that effects the kids and the families. The little I know about TX this seems about right.

Guilty until proven innocent.

I think you're looking at it backward. They DO have strict eligibility rules. If you have a player that has moved to your district, you must prove they didn't do it for athletics. Granted - 90% of these moves are players that no one is going to challenge or bring to the UIL's attention - and SOME of those did actually move for athletics. But when a blue chipper moves from urban Houston to live in rural Odessa - it gets noticed.

By the way... how do you, from your far-away spot long distant from any of this back story that you're hearing today for the first time, make the assumption that a policy that has evolved over about 30 years is "knee jerk"?????

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by CountTheBasket

Separate from even using it to try and define his character, if I have a son in Texas who is an exceptional MS basketball player, and I want to move three towns over because they have a better HS program, the state of TX tries to say you cannot do that? Did I miss something here...?

Yes ... the state of Texas doesn't TRY to say you cannot do that. It flat out says you can't do that. And before people start into saying things like "I should have every right to move if it gives my kid a better shot at athletics" - you have to remember why this was created. It wasn't that long ago that athletics in Texas involved full blown recruiting - complete with high schools paying players/parents to move to their districts, and including giving parents high paying jobs to get them to move. (See Odessa Permian football as a particularly egregious example, but it was everywhere). This is why the laws exist - to prevent that from occurring again.

[Texas Aggie]

he doesn't have the means to move from one neighborhood to another

Either you have no clue what I'm talking about (or what you're talking about for that matter) or you're being a clown. Parents move for their kid's athletic purpose. Its happened quite a bit. In Texas, it is a violation of UIL rules. Anyway, I doubt the parent does it without the full cooperation and knowledge of the kid. In Smart's situation, he actually lived with a teammate at the new HS for a while -- and not his own family. If I were you, I would refrain from commenting on things you clearly don't know the facts on. If you needed some clarification, please ask.

The relevance it has to the situation -- and I really can't believe I have to spell this out -- is that given this incident is a question of credibility -- what Smart said vs. what the fan said, my point was that Smart's past tended to point to some possible credibility issues. You can of course make your own decision, but to suggest his past is not relevant to his propensity to tell the truth is absolutely absurd.

[JRutledge]

It is illegal under many state rules to move for athletic reasons. But we all know that no one has to tell anyone why they move. If they do all the things BNR says, you can move. And if I want to go to another house or go work in another community, it is hard to tell anyone they cannot do that. Or better yet, how are you going to prove that was the reasonsing? Parents are doing to do what is best for their kids, even if it is not technically legal under some elgibility rules.

Peace

[deecee]

[QUOTE=Texas Aggie;922235]I doubt the parent does it without the full cooperation and knowledge of the kid.[QUOTE]

Since when are the decisions of adults and parents determined by the will of the kids? I don't disagree that parents do this kind of stuff. But the penalty should be levied on the school district, i.e. loss of games, etc. If a parent is willing to uproot a whole family, and buy a house/and or move to a new city, who cares what the reason is. That's my point. Texas takes HS sports way to serious, and its just as corrupt as the NCAA.

But I don't imagine many adults making a decision based on what their kids thought was best.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie

Either you have no clue what I'm talking about (or what you're talking about for that matter) or you're being a clown. Parents move for their kid's athletic purpose. Its happened quite a bit. In Texas, it is a violation of UIL rules. Anyway, I doubt the parent does it without the full cooperation and knowledge of the kid. In Smart's situation, he actually lived with a teammate at the new HS for a while -- and not his own family. If I were you, I would refrain from commenting on things you clearly don't know the facts on. If you needed some clarification, please ask.

The relevance it has to the situation -- and I really can't believe I have to spell this out -- is that given this incident is a question of credibility -- what Smart said vs. what the fan said, my point was that Smart's past tended to point to some possible credibility issues. You can of course make your own decision, but to suggest his past is not relevant to his propensity to tell the truth is absolutely absurd.

His credibility is affected by decisions made by his parents to move to another residence, or to pull him out of a school and enroll him in another school?

Sorry, but my 15 year-old can not switch schools, I make that decision. My 15 year-old most definitely can't just move to a new residence.

I've had to move both my sons to different schools (without moving). My kids had ZERO input on the matters. Those decisions included switching their legal residence from one parent to the other, even though no actual changes were made to our custody arrangements. Say we did it for sports-related reasons. So because my ex' and I made some decisions about school enrollment, our sons' credibility comes into question when they are sophomores in college? Wow!!!

And I'm being a clown?