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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sun Jan 05, 2014, 12:50am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Definitely a technical foul.

Now since you have a player who is clearly unhappy with the amount of contact which you are deeming incidental, you may wish to reconsider your thinking on that point.

When players are airborne, they are at risk of injury and cannot control their balance when contacted. Thus officials are instructed to "protect the shooter." Basically, what this means is that we have to diligently scrutinize any contact on an airborne player attempting to shoot, pass, or even rebound. The amount of contact may be far less than when players are in contact with the floor, but may have much more impact upon a player's body movement, ability to make the desired play, or under how great of a risk of injury it places the player. Such factors form the difference between marginal and illegal contact.

Key points to help us determine the legality of any such contact are the positioning of the players prior to becoming airborne, verticality, and who is the initiator.

So rather than simply discount the player's expression of displeasure as an example of poor sportsmanship which one should penalize and then move on from, I would advise considering it an opportunity to re-evaluate how much physical contact you are allowing on drives to the basket and subsequent airborne players. What kind of feedback are you getting from the players, coaches, and your partners? Is this the only incident of an unhappy participant which you've experienced or are you getting a few complaints a game?
The start of your post is "Definitely a Technical," but then you immediately change to reconsider and reevalute the amount of contact. One or the other!!

I agree with the stance of not quite enough for a T for me. That is assuming that the statement wasn't accompanied by some theatrics, such as throwing his arms up in the air, or some stare-down. However, I also wouldn't let it go without a "that's enough" comment, or something similar.
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Old Sun Jan 05, 2014, 06:36am
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Originally Posted by frezer11 View Post
The start of your post is "Definitely a Technical," but then you immediately change to reconsider and reevalute the amount of contact. One or the other!!
Why do you think it has to be one or the other? Can't we penalize the poor behavior of the player for his non-contact expression of displeasure, but then also evaluate whether his claim about illegal contact during the attempt had any merit despite its improper delivery?
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sun Jan 05, 2014, 11:04am
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And now the rest of the story.

This took place towards the end of the first half with H up 20+

Coach asked me what he said. I told him and he give me a grin like I was a moron and said "well he did get fouled."

When the player returned later in the game. He did apologize.
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Old Mon Jan 06, 2014, 04:39am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremy341a View Post
Coach asked me what he said.
It's not WHAT he said...it's HOW he said it.
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Old Mon Jan 06, 2014, 11:52am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RookieDude View Post
It's not WHAT he said...it's HOW he said it.

Right on the money RookieDude, I had to fill out our online form for "loss of coaching box", AKA Technical. As I was putting in the details, it sounded like the guy didn't deserve it. However, it's HOW he said it.
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Old Mon Jan 06, 2014, 10:13am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremy341a View Post
And now the rest of the story.

This took place towards the end of the first half with H up 20+

Coach asked me what he said. I told him and he give me a grin like I was a moron and said "well he did get fouled."

When the player returned later in the game. He did apologize.
Earlier in the season I called a player for a traveling violation. I was the T and turned to become the L. The player looked directly at me and "bounced" the ball should height OOB, neither in my direction or my partner's direction. I T'd him. Coach asks me what he did. I said "coach, he looked at me and bounced the ball OOB, out of spite because he didn't like the call." He says, "yeah, but how high did the ball go?" I said "shoulder height." He says, "you're gonna T him for that?" Yup. As mentioned previously, it's not necessarily the action to me, it's the way the action is delivered.
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Old Mon Jan 06, 2014, 10:22am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColeTops25 View Post
... Coach asks me what he did. I said "coach, he looked at me and bounced the ball OOB, out of spite because he didn't like the call." He says, "yeah, but how high did the ball go?" I said "shoulder height." He says, "you're gonna T him for that?" Yup. As mentioned previously, it's not necessarily the action to me, it's the way the action is delivered.
My answer would have been, "it doesn't matter", followed by him looking at the back of my head.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old Mon Jan 06, 2014, 10:25am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColeTops25 View Post
Earlier in the season I called a player for a traveling violation. I was the T and turned to become the L. The player looked directly at me and "bounced" the ball should height OOB, neither in my direction or my partner's direction. I T'd him. Coach asks me what he did. I said "coach, he looked at me and bounced the ball OOB, out of spite because he didn't like the call." He says, "yeah, but how high did the ball go?" I said "shoulder height." He says, "you're gonna T him for that?" Yup. As mentioned previously, it's not necessarily the action to me, it's the way the action is delivered.
No offense intended here, but imho, this conversation went on FAR longer than it should have.
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Old Mon Jan 06, 2014, 11:49am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
No offense intended here, but imho, this conversation went on FAR longer than it should have.
Right. I gave the coach 15 seconds of my time. Interpersonal skills go a long way in this avocation.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old Mon Jan 06, 2014, 11:55am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColeTops25 View Post
Right. I gave the coach 15 seconds of my time. Interpersonal skills go a long way in this avocation.
15 seconds is a very long time... but that said, if he's discussing something, 15 seconds can be fine. If he's kvetching, cut him off.
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old Sun Jan 05, 2014, 11:16am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Why do you think it has to be one or the other? Can't we penalize the poor behavior of the player for his non-contact expression of displeasure, but then also evaluate whether his claim about illegal contact during the attempt had any merit despite its improper delivery?
Exactly.
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