Team control, throw-in, IW

[rsl]

Say the possession arrow points to B, and A1 throws a long pass to a streaking A2 for an easy lay-up. But, before A2 can get a hand on the ball, we have an IW.

Anyone up for giving the ball to B?

Whether team control during a TI applies or not, an IW can be extremely unfair to one team or the other.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by rsl

Say the possession arrow points to B, and A1 throws a long pass to a streaking A2 for an easy lay-up. But, before A2 can get a hand on the ball, we have an IW.
Anyone up for giving the ball to B?

Whether team control during a TI applies or not, an IW can be extremely unfair to one team or the other.

Throw-in did not end prior to IW, so POI is throw-in.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by rsl

Say the possession arrow points to B, and A1 throws a long pass to a streaking A2 for an easy lay-up. But, before A2 can get a hand on the ball, we have an IW.

Anyone up for giving the ball to B?

Whether team control during a TI applies or not, an IW can be extremely unfair to one team or the other.

Why would we give the ball to B? In your scenario we've already screwed up by most likely taking two points away from Team A on the IW. Now we'd be compounding the error by taking the ball away from Team A through the AP arrow. You think that's fair? At that point just finish the play by immediately calling a T on Team A's coach because that's the next thing that's going to happen.

Don't make a screw-up worse by making stuff up, especially stuff that isn't supported by rule.

[rsl]

Maybe I don't understand all of this thread. Help me out.

Say the possession arrow points to B, and A1 throws a long pass to a streaking A2 for an easy lay-up. A2 touches, but has not yet controlled the ball when an IW happens.

What is the call then?

TI has ended. If team control during TI applies only for the purpose of team control fouls, there is no team control in bounds yet.

[Adam]

And this is where the debate lies. For me, until the NFHS clarifies this particular situation, I'm going with the written rule. By rule, TC continues after the throw in. The NFHS has made it clear they don't want it applying to BC violations, but that's an exception to the rule.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Adam

And this is where the debate lies. For me, until the NFHS clarifies this particular situation, I'm going with the written rule. By rule, TC continues after the throw in. The NFHS has made it clear they don't want it applying to BC violations, but that's an exception to the rule.

Put me in the camp that TC applies until the defending team gains possession and that there is a special exception that only allows BC violations after PC has been gained inbounds.

[just another ref]

This is deeper than just the debate about team control. In the OP, assuming the ball hit the bottom of the board, this should have been nothing, but was called a violation. But now what to do if this incorrect whistle sounds a split second before the ball is grabbed out of the air by team B? I'm gonna let the incorrectly called violation stand rather than change it to an accidental whistle and give the ball back to A.

[bob jenkins]

there's a play in the NCAAW case book. I think it's also in the NCAAM book. A1 jumps from inbouds, grabs the ball and is about to land out of bounds. A1 requests a TO, and the official blows the whistle. (For those who don't know, in NCAA, the TO should NOT be granted in this case).

Ruling: IW, give the ball back to A, even though the "logical and obvious" conclusion of the play if there was no whistle would be a violation on A and the ball to B.

I don't see that as much different from the IW when B is about to grab the ball after it hits the bottom of the backboard, or any of the other plays that have been presented here to show why the IW rule might be "unfair."

[johnny d]

Originally Posted by just another ref

This is deeper than just the debate about team control. In the OP, assuming the ball hit the bottom of the board, this should have been nothing, but was called a violation. But now what to do if this incorrect whistle sounds a split second before the ball is grabbed out of the air by team B? I'm gonna let the incorrectly called violation stand rather than change it to an accidental whistle and give the ball back to A.

This is never a good philosophy. When officials start making judgments as to what is fair/not fair and using that as the basis for the calls they make, only bad things can happen.