Rebounding Contact (video)

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

We (I don't now why I used the first person, plural personal pronoun here) have to constantly fight that urge.

...I noticed you have a religous reference in your signature...maybe it has something to do with that?

Trinity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

... As one gracefully ages, and loses a few steps (adds a few pounds, and gets more gray hair, not that I would know anything about any of those things), one becomes inclined to take a step back on the shot to get ahead of the next play, assuming a rebound, and a transition, down to the other end of the court. ....

This has nothing to do with age, instead it comes from a lack of training and/or discipline. Needs to be one of the basics instilled into new officials.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

This has nothing to do with age, instead it comes from a lack of training and/or discipline. Needs to be one of the basics instilled into new officials.

Agreed, and it's a little painful to see it in a college game.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Adam

Agreed, and it's a little painful to see it in a college game.

Absolutely drives me crazy when I'm watching a game on TV.

[JRutledge]

The main thing I have a problem with mechanically is that both officials go up for a 3 point shot (signal). That tells me either both are watching the ball or likely watching the same thing. Also the C is very high on this play and should have closed down. Almost the entire purpose to have a C is so that another official is there to rule on rebounding. On the other hand, I do not have as much problem for when the T left as he stayed until it was evident that the rebound was mostly over. That being if the T stayed a little longer he might have seen this play better and helped. But this is the reason I feel we as officials need to get away from the idea that the L cannot call rebounding fouls. The L should have been the main person to make this call.

Peace

[RookieDude]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

This has nothing to do with age, instead it comes from a lack of training and/or discipline. Needs to be one of the basics instilled into new officials.

Bingo! We train our new guys (and all the old guys that want to keep their place on the pecking order) to take a "step in" on a shot (so even if they don't actually take a "step in"...at least they are not "bailing out")

...also, the "C" or "T", depending on 2 or 3 Whistle crew...should take a step in on the last Free Throw. The next time you watch a game...see how many officials actually use this mechanic.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

...also, the "C" or "T", depending on 2 or 3 Whistle crew...should take a step in on the last Free Throw. The next time you watch a game...see how many officials actually use this mechanic.

Not a lot. And it usually is because we think we are going to get beat and we do not hang around long enough. I see it all summer in camps with even the most experienced officials.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

... going to get beat and we do not hang around long enough. I see it all summer in camps with even the most experienced officials.

... because it's the most experienced officials who are older, a step slower, with a few more gray hairs, or a few less hairs. The young'uns hold their spot as the trail on a shot, even move in a step to get a good look at the rebounding action, and then know that they can beat the kids down to the endline on other end of the court. I used to be that fast many years ago. Now I find myself often doing a button hook maneuver to get a good look at fast break action down the other end. But, at least, I still try to take a step in, as the trail, on a shot, either a field goal, or a free throw. When I can't do that anymore, then it's probably time to hang up my Reebok Zigs.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Needs to be one of the basics instilled into new officials.

You must have missed this part:

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Here in two person Connecticut, we are taught, from the crib, as the trail, to always take a step toward the basket on a shot.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

...and all the old guys that want to keep their place on the pecking order to take a "step in" on a shot, so even if they don't actually take a "step in", at least they are not "bailing out".

Same thing here in my little corner of Connecticut. It's a criticism that we varsity officials often mention to the subvarsity guys, and the same criticism will often show up on written evaluations of varsity officials by other varsity officials.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

You must have missed this part:

No, I addressed with the bolded part:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

This has nothing to do with age, instead it comes from a lack of training and/or discipline. Needs to be one of the basics instilled into new officials.

Once it's taught the officials need to use it. I've found that really has nothing to do with the age of officials.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

... because it's the most experienced officials who are older, a step slower, with a few more gray hairs, or a few less hairs. The young'uns hold their spot as the trail on a shot, even move in a step to get a good look at the rebounding action, and then know that they can beat the kids down to the endline on other end of the court. I used to be that fast many years ago. Now I find myself often doing a button hook maneuver to get a good look at fast break action down the other end. But, at least, I still try to take a step in, as the trail, on a shot, either a field goal, or a free throw. When I can't do that anymore, then it's probably time to hang up my Reebok Zigs.

As stated, this has nothing to do with grey hair or age of the officials. I know very young officials that do the same thing and bail on shots and still get beat. If you are trained enough in 3 person, you will get beat and that is OK. And it is not because of how fast you are, but if you are doing the right things there will get beat on a fast break you just will not completely anticipate and the players are going to have a head start on you. I am certainly not slow and I accept the fact with my training I will get beat from time to time. The rebound is just more important then being ahead of a couple of players for a moment.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I've found that really has nothing to do with the age of officials.

I've found otherwise, although age may be only one of a few factors. When officials get slower, due to age, joint, and muscle problems, weight gain, out of shape, lack of conditioning during the offseason, etc., they lose a step and can adjust in either one of two ways. One way is to bail out early on shots down one end to get a head start back to the other end of the court. The other way is to hang in there, as the trail on a shot, watching for rebounding action, and realize that they may not make it all the way back down to the endline in front of the players, and may have to use their experience to fight for a position, and a good look, from somewhere else other than the endline to catch the action in a fast break situation. Here in my little corner of Connecticut, we prefer that slower officials hang in there on a shot, and use their experience to get a good angle down the other end if they can't make it to the endline.

In my case, I admit, that I'm not the same weight that I was thirty-two years ago, but I haven't gained any appreciable weight in the past fifteen years. I still run on weekends in the off season, just like I've been doing the past thirty-plus years. I've even added a little bicycle riding, and paddling a kayak, to my workout routine. So why have I lost a few steps over the past fifteen years? Age, and the muscle, and joint, problems that have come with age, and a lifetime of running, tennis, bicycling, basketball, football, baseball, hockey, etc. My latest problem is patellofemoral pain syndrome. This may eventually do me in, I can't walk down a flight of stairs without some degree of pain. At this point, luckily, I can still run with no pain, but after I run is when the pain kicks in. My doctor says that it's an age related, overuse injury, that I have the knees of a ninety-nine year old man.

So age, and age related problems, are certainly part of the problem, not the entire problem, but a part of the problem. Now that I'm slower, I constantly have to fight the urge to bail out and get back early, an urge that I never had fifteen years ago. I can fight that urge, some can't.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

The rebound is just more important then being ahead of a couple of players for a moment.

Well said. Which is exactly how we train all of our officials, young, old, experienced, and inexperienced.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

As stated, this has nothing to do with grey hair or age of the officials. I know very young officials that do the same thing and bail on shots and still get beat. If you are trained enough in 3 person, you will get beat and that is OK. And it is not because of how fast you are, but if you are doing the right things there will get beat on a fast break you just will not completely anticipate and the players are going to have a head start on you. I am certainly not slow and I accept the fact with my training I will get beat from time to time. The rebound is just more important then being ahead of a couple of players for a moment.

Peace

Agreed. Best statement I heard regarding this type of situation: "Officiate what's in front of you, not what you think will happen."