Rebounding

[Forksref]

JV game this week: Player B has good block out position on rebounding and is moving the A player back during the shot. The A player did not jump. Coach of B says, "That HAS to be over the back." On the transition the other way I tell the coach, "Not when he's backing up. Who initiated contact?"

I know it's semantics, but "over the back" is legal to me, "ON the back is a foul." That applies to this situation: Earlier in the game we had a very tall player from the A team go up and get a rebound over the shorter B player who has position in front of A. No contact. Of course the B coach wanted a foul. I wish they would realize that it IS possible for a player from behind to get a rebound cleanly AND it is possible for the inside player to be the one to initiate the contact. I like the verticality principle, but most coaches and fans have no clue.

[ChrisSportsFan]

I'm going to create some laminated flash cards to keep in my back pocket. I think I'll only need about 6-8 responses for coaches. When a coach asks a legitimate question, I'll do my best to answer, but if coach is being stupid, then I'll give him a flash card that will explain what happened. When I get this technique down, I'll mass produce and let you guys know where to purchase them. What responses should I have prepared? I'm thinking:
1. Explain verticality vs "over the back".
2. Gotta start your dribble before the pivot foot leaves the floor.
3. All 3 points gotta be across.
4. That wasn't a carry/double dribble/travel, it was just ugly.
5. If you're standing then you're coaching, if you're complaining, please refer to 10.4.1
6. ?????

Of course there will be a disclaimer at the bottom that says: this card must be returned to the ref within 2 trips down the court. I don't have time to keep replacing these cards.

[Forksref]

Originally posted by ChrisSportsFan
I'm going to create some laminated flash cards to keep in my back pocket. I think I'll only need about 6-8 responses for coaches. When a coach asks a legitimate question, I'll do my best to answer, but if coach is being stupid, then I'll give him a flash card that will explain what happened. When I get this technique down, I'll mass produce and let you guys know where to purchase them. What responses should I have prepared? I'm thinking:
1. Explain verticality vs "over the back".
2. Gotta start your dribble before the pivot foot leaves the floor.
3. All 3 points gotta be across.
4. That wasn't a carry/double dribble/travel, it was just ugly.
5. If you're standing then you're coaching, if you're complaining, please refer to 10.4.1
6. ?????

Of course there will be a disclaimer at the bottom that says: this card must be returned to the ref within 2 trips down the court. I don't have time to keep replacing these cards.

Chris,let's add these:

4-A: It was a high dribble.
6. Let's do lunch.
7. Didn't we decide before the game that you were going to coach and I was going to officiate? If not, then I must say that your man defense sucks!

[johnnyrao]

How about "Coach, I can't penalize height".

Everyone always wants "over the back" when a 6'4" player goes vertical and reaches over a 5'9" player and clearly gets the ball with no contact.

[Forksref]

Originally posted by johnnyrao
How about "Coach, I can't penalize height".

Everyone always wants "over the back" when a 6'4" player goes vertical and reaches over a 5'9" player and clearly gets the ball with no contact.

Good one, Johnny!

[FrankHtown]

That does beg the question: How much "boxing out" do you allow before it becomes displacement?

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Forksref
JV game this week: Player B has good block out position on rebounding and is moving the A player back during the shot.

Did you consider the possibility that this is a foul?

Would you allow the same player to turn around and push Player A with both hands?

What's the difference?

[Junker]

I agree. If Player B is backing out Player A, there should be a foul on Player B. Both have the legal right to their rebounding position and there shouldn't be any displacement.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

Did you consider the possibility that this is a foul?

Would you allow the same player to turn around and push Player A with both hands?

What's the difference?

A few weeks ago during a HS game A1 backed B1 out like this afer a shot until they were both OOB standing behind me at lead.

During a different game A1 pushed B1 down to the ground at my feet during rebounding action.

2 different games but the coach's response was the same:

"How can that be a foul?? He was boxing out!!"

So I guess they are the same.

[eventnyc]

"Coach you're ugly!"

[Forksref]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

Did you consider the possibility that this is a foul?

Would you allow the same player to turn around and push Player A with both hands?

What's the difference?

I definitely consider this a possible foul. As a matter of fact, I called one a week agolike this. I judge it on the basis of severity and adv/disadv. In the above-mentioned case though, I didn't consider it a foul.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

Did you consider the possibility that this is a foul?

Would you allow the same player to turn around and push Player A with both hands?

What's the difference?

And it's not an "over-the-back" foul on A, it's pushing or holding on B. If you call this, Coach B may have a conniption fit, and then you'll need a laminated card for, "Displacement isn't legal, coach."

[TriggerMN]

Originally posted by eventnyc
"Coach you're ugly!"

*LMAO*

Freaking hilarious!!!

[Forksref]

Originally posted by rainmaker

And it's not an "over-the-back" foul on A, it's pushing or holding on B. If you call this, Coach B may have a conniption fit, and then you'll need a laminated card for, "Displacement isn't legal, coach."

As far as "over the back" as a way to report a foul....never did it.......never will.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by FrankHtown
That does beg the question: How much "boxing out" do you allow before it becomes displacement?

By rule, 72.4%.

Oh yeah, make sure the flash cards are in one syllable words with lots of pictures or the coach won't understand them.