"Continuous" issues...

[APG]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Go back and look at what I said on page 1, post 7. I said that i probably is a shooting foul.

I'm just disputing the terminology and justification some are using to say it is. Those elements (gather) do not automatically mean shot when there are other options in the area. It might mean shot, but a pass or nothing is still a possibility.

And my post is surprise that it's close for some...that play isn't "probably" a shooting foul IMO...it's clearly and obviously during the act of shooting IMO.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by APG

And my post is surprise that it's close for some...that play isn't "probably" a shooting foul IMO...it's clearly and obviously during the act of shooting IMO.

Guess what.. I just went back and watch it again. I agree.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Guess what.. I just went back and watch it again. I agree.

Me too.

At first viewing, I thought "shooting foul, but I could understand someone who disagreed." Watching it again, I don't think it's all that close.

[Rich]

Let's talk about something reasonably related to this:

When I see contact that likely rises to the level of a foul and I'm being patient and trying to decide whether to put a whistle on it, I'll hold off on the whistle until it's clear to everyone that I'm putting the foul on the shot.

Example: B31 has a hand on the hip of A22. It stays there, guiding A22 away from the bucket. A22 continues to drive and goes up with a shot. I could've whistled a foul anytime along this path, but I decided to hold it until it's clear that B31 isn't taking the hand off...by then, A22 is in the act of shooting. Shooting foul.

I guess what I'm saying is that I'm looking for a reason to put it on the shot if I can -- surely I'm not the only one who does this. If I'm calling it before the shot, then it's pretty obvious and I do not feel the need to oversell this (to convince everyone, including myself, that the shooter wasn't shooting).

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Rich

Let's talk about something reasonably related to this:

When I see contact that likely rises to the level of a foul and I'm being patient and trying to decide whether to put a whistle on it, I'll hold off on the whistle until it's clear to everyone that I'm putting the foul on the shot.

Example: B31 has a hand on the hip of A22. It stays there, guiding A22 away from the bucket. A22 continues to drive and goes up with a shot. I could've whistled a foul anytime along this path, but I decided to hold it until it's clear that B31 isn't taking the hand off...by then, A22 is in the act of shooting. Shooting foul.

I guess what I'm saying is that I'm looking for a reason to put it on the shot if I can -- surely I'm not the only one who does this. If I'm calling it before the shot, then it's pretty obvious and I do not feel the need to oversell this (to convince everyone, including myself, that the shooter wasn't shooting).

I do exactly the same. But if they get the hand off and they continue to the shot after it is gone, you really can't get both the foul and put them on the line. I'm only giving them that if there is fouling contact that continues into the shot.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I do exactly the same. But if they get the hand off and they continue to the shot after it is gone, you really can't get both the foul and put them on the line. I'm only giving them that if there is fouling contact that continues into the shot.

If they get the hand off, then it's gotta be a quick decision on whether to pass entirely or go back to get the foul.

9 times out of 10, I'm probably passing entirely at that point. If it really needed a whistle earlier....

(And this is probably the kind of discussion that confuses newer officials and people that don't officiate.)

[bob jenkins]

That used to be SOP in NCAAW. Then, a couple or three years ago, it became a POE (or at least emphasized at camp, if not an actual POE), to get the foul when it happens and not hold off for the shot on the drive.

So, that's what I try to do now. :shrug:

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by Rich

I guess what I'm saying is that I'm looking for a reason to put it on the shot if I can -- surely I'm not the only one who does this. If I'm calling it before the shot, then it's pretty obvious and I do not feel the need to oversell this (to convince everyone, including myself, that the shooter wasn't shooting).

I do the same thing.