"Continuous" issues...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

So are we - as H.S. officials - worried we'll take grief for making "NBA calls?"

What bothered me even more about these plays is they're in the playoffs. I would assume - based on my own experiences - playoff officials have some level of college experience so they should have worked out the kinks on these calls.

The college thing would not be a factor here and honestly I see HS only guys love to wave off shots. And in my experience a lot of college guys around this part of the country (what they tell me) is they do not work a lot of HS ball at all.

Peace

[OKREF]

1,2,4, and 5 for certain. On 3, looks like the shooting motion started after the foul.

[JRutledge]

I have to tell this funny story.

I was watching a couple of my playoff games this week online. One of the teams that we had twice was had their local radio commentators doing the broadcast along with the video. First of all they got my name wrong (kind of hard to do when I am the only Black person working in the entire regional and one guy was Hispanic and had an Hispanic sounding name) all week. And then when I had two fouls that resulted in shots being counted, they misrepresented what I had signaled. Now my signal might not be purely out fo the book from a look standpoint, but it clearly could not be anything else but counting the basket as my hand comes downward from a "foul signal" mechanic. They said about 3 times that, "He signalled to the floor." I just had to laugh and wonder how stupid they sounded when clearly I would go to the table and count the basket before reporting the number of the player that fouled. I guess the only conclusion other than pure ignorance on their part (and that was there all week) was that officials must be signalling to the floor often when they are not calling a shooting foul. I even had a foul in one of the games where I waved off a shot by waving my arms and they still did not "get it."

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I have to tell this funny story.

I was watching a couple of my playoff games this week online. One of the teams that we had twice was had their local radio commentators doing the broadcast along with the video. First of all they got my name wrong (kind of hard to do when I am the only Black person working in the entire regional and one guy was Hispanic and had an Hispanic sounding name) all week. And then when I had two fouls that resulted in shots being counted, they misrepresented what I had signaled. Now my signal might not be purely out fo the book from a look standpoint, but it clearly could not be anything else but counting the basket as my hand comes downward from a "foul signal" mechanic. They said about 3 times that, "He signalled to the floor." I just had to laugh and wonder how stupid they sounded when clearly I would go to the table and count the basket before reporting the number of the player that fouled. I guess the only conclusion other than pure ignorance on their part (and that was there all week) was that officials must be signalling to the floor often when they are not calling a shooting foul. I even had a foul in one of the games where I waved off a shot by waving my arms and they still did not "get it."

JRut, I do some b'casting myself (hockey and other sports if I can get them). I've always loved the "wait, it looks like they've changed the foul to..." comment. I always start screaming at the screen, "Um, no, they didn't change the foul! You guys just identified the wrong guy!"

[zm1283]

All I have to say about these clips is

[Adam]

Wow, I just watched them. While 3 is close, I'm still giving her that shot. And the first three are all at the Iowa State Tournament (Final 8 teams of each class) in Des Moines.

Maybe once a season will I hear a coach ask "wasn't he/she shooting?"

More often, I hear, "Wasn't it on the floor?"

[RadioBlue]

All but 4 look like shooting fouls to me. I think in #4 you might have a patient whistle there and the foul actually occurring on the feed pass.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by RadioBlue

All but 4 look like shooting fouls to me. I think in #4 you might have a patient whistle there and the foul actually occurring on the feed pass.

If he's calling that "bump", he needs to be slightly more patient and let it go (IMO). Calling it after your inside beast has the ball and a 4-foot jumper just looks horrible. And you've rewarded the defense for poor defense. It's like calling the hack on the wrist in transition as the pass is landing in the hands of a wide open teammate, in stride, for a layup.

[deecee]

Yup all 3 look like they should be shooting foul shots. Also the last 2 are from me old alma mater in So Cal.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by Adam

If he's calling that "bump", he needs to be slightly more patient and let it go (IMO). Calling it after your inside beast has the ball and a 4-foot jumper just looks horrible. And you've rewarded the defense for poor defense. It's like calling the hack on the wrist in transition as the pass is landing in the hands of a wide open teammate, in stride, for a layup.

I agree with you completely here but my issue with the patient whistle is that it does have an expiration. Like the hack on the wrist. Do you wait to see how badly was the pass altered before calling the foul?

[kk13]

Some people are questioning #3. It looks to me like she had "collected" was fouled and then completed the try. AND ONE in my book!

[Scuba_ref]

Originally Posted by OKREF

1,2,4, and 5 for certain. On 3, looks like the shooting motion started after the foul.

The gather was well before the foul on #3. Not even a question in my mind! Send her to the line. The shooting motion starts when the ball is gathered and the dribble has ended.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by kk13

Some people are questioning #3. It looks to me like she had "collected" was fouled and then completed the try. AND ONE in my book!

Originally Posted by Scuba_ref

The gather was well before the foul on #3. Not even a question in my mind! Send her to the line. The shooting motion starts when the ball is gathered and the dribble has ended.

First, "gather"/"collect", while we often use it as an indicator could just as well precede a pass. In #3, it wasn't clear to me that she had yet made up her mind on what she was going to do with the ball. She was going in a direction not exactly to the hoop, got fouled, then turned to the basket....almost as if I was an afterthought. I can't say she wasn't shooting and wouldn't criticize anyone who puts her on the line, but it is also not unreasonable to say she wasn't shooting on that one.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

First, "gather"/"collect", while we often use it as an indicator could just as well precede a pass. In #3, it wasn't clear to me that she had yet made up her mind on what she was going to do with the ball. She was going in a direction not exactly to the hoop, got fouled, then turned to the basket....almost as if I was an afterthought. I can't say she wasn't shooting and wouldn't criticize anyone who puts her on the line, but it is also not unreasonable to say she wasn't shooting on that one.

I agree with this. While I would have probably put her on the line, if she had consistently made this move prior to passing before this play, it's possible I could have considered this a common foul.

I tend to err on the side of free throws, though (except in the occasional little kids' games where free throws are not advantageous), so putting her on the line here would have been my call 99% of the time.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

First, "gather"/"collect", while we often use it as an indicator could just as well precede a pass. In #3, it wasn't clear to me that she had yet made up her mind on what she was going to do with the ball. She was going in a direction not exactly to the hoop, got fouled, then turned to the basket....almost as if I was an afterthought. I can't say she wasn't shooting and wouldn't criticize anyone who puts her on the line, but it is also not unreasonable to say she wasn't shooting on that one.

Well you focus so much on rules, but the rules do not say that we are to mind read. If the player did everything that looks like a shot, they are shooting. We have had this discussion before, but not sure how she does not look like she is shooting when she is taking on two defenders. It might be a bad shot, but it is still a shot. IMO that was the worst one not to call shooting.

Peace