Communication with partner

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by OKREF

You did. Shoot the ball means leaving the hands to me.

You kind of picked and choosed what you wanted out of his post. "Pass the ball" also means leaving the hands. His comparison was strictly between shooting or passing the ball. Not holding the ball:

"Look, if a player wants me to think they are shooting, then shoot the ball. If a player wants me to think they are passing, then pass the ball. Not all players that gather and jump in the air are shooting. Otherwise if a player gathers and gets the ball knocked out his hands or knocked the the floor whether they release the ball to shoot or pass, they are getting shots from me.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Is it very wrong because you disagree with it?

Look, if a player wants me to think they are shooting, then shoot the ball. If a player wants me to think they are passing, then pass the ball. Not all players that gather and jump in the air are shooting. Otherwise if a player gathers and gets the ball knocked out his hands or knocked the the floor whether they release the ball to shoot or pass, they are getting shots from me. After all this is all about judgment anyway. There is ultimately nothing right or wrong either way. I am just not rewarding a player that is not smart enough to know to not pass the ball if you want the total benefit of the foul.

Peace

Originally Posted by JRutledge

He takes away the doubt when he passes the ball. If the ball was lost or there was some real question as to what took place or what they were going to do (e.g. fumbling the ball after contact) then I would award shots. It should not be hard to understand. If the player wants everyone to know what they were doing, then shoot the darn ball. Why is that hard to understand?

Peace

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

You kind of picked and choosed what you wanted out of his post. "Pass the ball" also means leaving the hands. His comparison was strictly between shooting or passing the ball. Not holding the ball:

"Look, if a player wants me to think they are shooting, then shoot the ball. If a player wants me to think they are passing, then pass the ball. Not all players that gather and jump in the air are shooting. Otherwise if a player gathers and gets the ball knocked out his hands or knocked the the floor whether they release the ball to shoot or pass, they are getting shots from me.

Well it was said twice in two different situations.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by OKREF

You did. Shoot the ball means leaving the hands to me.

No it does not. The act of shooting beings long before the release of the ball (by rule that some of you love to keep talking about) Sorry, nice try. I have awarded many shooting fouls without a ball being released. Got crap for them just about every time.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by OKREF

Well it was said twice in two different situations.

"Passing the ball" means leaving the players hand but you are ignoring that all together.

I don't see a single phrase or sentence in the posts you quoted that said the ball must "leave a player's hands" in order for it to be a shooting foul.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

"Passing the ball" means leaving the players hand but you are ignoring that all together.

I don't see a single phrase or sentence in the posts you quoted that said the ball must "leave a player's hands" in order for it to be a shooting foul.

Ok, maybe I am misinterpretating what was written. My apologies.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by OKREF

Ok, maybe I am misinterpretating what was written. My apologies.

I kinder, friendlier forum. Jurassic would be so proud right now

Now I have to find somebody at work to argue with.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by APG

NCAA and NBA...you're going to see that, more often then not, called a foul and judged to be no shot and on the pass off. Heck, NCAA even added a signal to indicate no shot due to a pass off.

And a lot of those times, the offensive player has already started shifting to the pass because they see the contact coming, not after the contact, and that makes a difference.

[APG]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

And a lot of those times, the offensive player has already started shifting to the pass because they see the contact coming, not after the contact, and that makes a difference.

Not in the games I watch...especially for an NBA game.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by OKREF

So, a player starts their normal shooting motion, gets hammered, official has a whistle. The offensive player isn't able to release the ball. Are you saying they aren't in the act of shooting? IMO if they begin their shooting motion and get fouled, it is a shooting foul. .

Right after I wrote that post I wanted to modify it but had to leave for a game. I should have said if they want the FTs then try to shoot the darn ball. I'm not going to penalize A1 if he/she gets hit hard enough that they can't release the ball. However, if they can get it out of their hands and purposely pass it to a teammate, for me, they've also passed up their chance at getting FTs.