WNBA: Jacket Removal and Toss

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Why do expect emotional responses to a 'T'? Both the player and the coach got T'd on a play that the official absolutely got right. So after being T'd for inappropriate behavior they should be allotted more inappropriate behavior?

They are already acting irrationally. Irrational people confronted with that irrationality are going to react with more irrationality.

Do you really expect them to suddenly become calm?

[tref]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

They are already acting irrationally. Irrational people confronted with that irrationality are going to react with more irrationality.

Do you really expect them to suddenly become calm?

If they know the 2nd T is coming (maybe not calm but more self control) Id say yes.
If they know they can get away with it, obviously not.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

They are already acting irrationally. Irrational people confronted with that irrationality are going to react with more irrationality.

Do you really expect them to suddenly become calm?

Yes, yes I do.

Remarkably, they usually do.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

They are already acting irrationally. Irrational people confronted with that irrationality are going to react with more irrationality.

Do you really expect them to suddenly become calm?

I've only ever had 1 coach who didn't immediately turn it down after getting hit with a Tech, so the norm for me is that they are more than capable of suddenly becoming calm.

That 1 coach I speak of received a 2nd T for his actions.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I've only ever had 1 coach who didn't immediately turn it down after getting hit with a Tech, so the norm for me is that they are more than capable of suddenly becoming calm.

That 1 coach I speak of received a 2nd T for his actions.

Sounds like it's one of those things that vary with locations then.

[zm1283]

In high school, this would earn a second technical from me.

I don't know about the college level or professional basketball. Just from watching D1 basketball, coaches often get away with murder and officials don't penalize them, so I have my doubts that a lot of D1 men's officials would penalize the jacket toss. Now if it were accompanied by yelling and other demonstrative behavior, then I could see another technical.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

Sounds like it's one of those things that vary with locations then.

It probably varies with enforcement. I've only had to issue a second T one time, in a summer travel game to an assistant coach.

Even this week I had a pretty emotional coach get a T, but he sat right down. If amateur coaches are capable of controling their emotions, the professionals can do it, too.

[REFANDUMP]

I don't think that warrants a second technical. Official absolutely blew the call in my opinion.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by REFANDUMP

I don't think that warrants a second technical. Official absolutely blew the call in my opinion.

Blew what call? The one where the defender put her hand on top of the ball and caused a turnover?

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Blew what call? The one where the defender put her hand on top of the ball and caused a turnover?

I'm looking at it full screen, frozen at about :40. The defender has a hand full of wrist and clearly restricts the arm. Absolutely a whistle is correct here. No justification for coach COMING ON THE COURT and protesting, but I think she deserves a little leeway on her response.

[JRutledge]

I have no problem giving a second T on this at any level that I work. I guess I would have to hear what she said or how she said things after getting the first T. I would want my partner to give the second one, but hey act better if you do not want anyone to think of calling this.

Peace

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by REFANDUMP

I don't think that warrants a second technical. Official absolutely blew the call in my opinion.

First, I completely disagree with you about the call being missed.

Second, and most important (for me anyway)...are you saying that you would ignore unsporting behavior from a coach simply because you think your partner blew a call???

[letemplay]

Does the "hand is part of the ball" apply when defender is reaching across, and susequently makes contact with (39 sec frame), the offensive player's arm? I have to question that she was unable to get her shot off, as much due to the contact on her arm as the hand on the ball. Small chance for held ball call here after seeing it a few times. As for the 2nd T, I'll weigh in with yes for HS, but prob no for pros.

[REFANDUMP]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

First, I completely disagree with you about the call being missed.

Second, and most important (for me anyway)...are you saying that you would ignore unsporting behavior from a coach simply because you think your partner blew a call???

I went back and looked at the play in stopped frames, and I'll have to agree with you. Contact was with the ball before any contact on the arm. Looked like a foul in full speed, and a whistle would have been incorrect.

Secondly, If I blow a call, I'll be patient before issuing a "T". I'll give the coach extra leeway in this situation. I've got my partners back if a "T" is warranted and my partner doesn't see the action that warrants the "T".

[Camron Rust]

For the Jacket, no. For other stuff (yelling along with it), perhaps. Just not for removing the jacket and throwing it to her bench/seat.