"They can't do that!"

[Rich]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

So you basically think that Tampa should have just quit? Why even put their defense out on the field then? As a football coach, I coach my players to play hard every down. When we take a knee, our linemen still fire off the ball, and our backs are ready to pick someone up coming off the end, and my QB takes a knee and then pops up and backs out of there...no reason to expect a defense to just stand there and do nothing.

My whistle is about as quick as it can get on a victory formation play. If the center-to-QB snap is clean, I blow it dead as soon as the knee starts for the ground.

I couldn't care less how anyone "coaches" this.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Rich

My whistle is about as quick as it can get on a victory formation play. If the center-to-QB snap is clean, I blow it dead as soon as the knee starts for the ground.

I couldn't care less how anyone "coaches" this.

I see...so basically you cheat and kill a play before it is over.

Nice.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

I see...so basically you cheat and kill a play before it is over.

Nice.

Nope, the QB is giving himself up and he has possession of the football. That's good enough for me. If he fumbles the snap, obviously it's a different story.

Local practice is that we are told the QB is taking a knee and we pinch in a bit and protect against anything stupid. We tell the defense that the offense is taking a knee, don't do anything stupid.

I've never seen anything even at the HS level like what the Bucs tried yesterday.

Why is it that coaches immediately go to calling officials "cheaters" and impugn our integrity. You'd think an official would know better than to do that.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Rich

Why is it that coaches immediately go to calling officials "cheaters" and impugn our integrity. You'd think an official would know better than to do that.

Agreed. Actually rather said that Rocky is an official.

Again we do a lot of things where philosophy applies to any rule and that does not change across other sports.

Peace

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Agreed. Actually rather said that Rocky is an official.

Again we do a lot of things where philosophy applies to any rule and that does not change across other sports.

Peace

Seemed clear to me that Rocky was making a rhetorical point, not accusing Rich of cheating.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Seemed clear to me that Rocky was making a rhetorical point, not accusing Rich of cheating.

For the record, this is correct...Rich, I do not think you are a cheater. Of course not...however, just because it's the last play does not mean we should expect the defense to just stand there and do nothing. And for you - or anyone on a forum like this - to dismiss someone's opinion about that just because they are a coach (the "I don't care how you coach it" comment) is just as insulting to that coach as being called a cheater is to an official. Had both - know what I am talking about.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Seemed clear to me that Rocky was making a rhetorical point, not accusing Rich of cheating.

Then what point is that? I know for a fact when I watch many games in basketball, basketball officials often do not get so technical about a travel or other insignificant violations when the game is ending. I do not read Rocky or others going on rants about someone "cheating" when it happens on every nationally televised game when the outcome is very certain. The outcome in a football game where someone is running the "V" formation is rather certain. Everyone tends to let up or to relax. It is good sportsmanship or it would not be done. So what point is he making? Again every sport has a way to end the game with some sportsmanship when the outcome is very clear. I think that is the way things should be done, now if others disagree that is fine. But would I be accusing someone of cheating by doing this in basketball or using common sense and ended the game by not calling a slight moving of a pivot foot as seconds are literally running off the clock?

Peace

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Then what point is that? I know for a fact when I watch many games in basketball, basketball officials often do not get so technical about a travel or other insignificant violations when the game is ending. I do not read Rocky or others going on rants about someone "cheating" when it happens on every nationally televised game when the outcome is very certain. The outcome in a football game where someone is running the "V" formation is rather certain. Everyone tends to let up or to relax. It is good sportsmanship or it would not be done. So what point is he making? Again every sport has a way to end the game with some sportsmanship when the outcome is very clear. I think that is the way things should be done, now if others disagree that is fine. But would I be accusing someone of cheating by doing this in basketball or using common sense and ended the game by not calling a slight moving of a pivot foot as seconds are literally running off the clock?

Peace

In a game where the margin is 3 points or less (one scoring trip), then yes you had better be on it. If Tampa had been down by 24 points, this would be a different discussion.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Rich

Nope, the QB is giving himself up and he has possession of the football. That's good enough for me. If he fumbles the snap, obviously it's a different story.

Local practice is that we are told the QB is taking a knee and we pinch in a bit and protect against anything stupid. We tell the defense that the offense is taking a knee, don't do anything stupid.

I've never seen anything even at the HS level like what the Bucs tried yesterday.

Why is it that coaches immediately go to calling officials "cheaters" and impugn our integrity. You'd think an official would know better than to do that.

Because you said that you would kill a play before it is over - as soon as the QB's knee STARTS toward the ground. You going to do that for everyone?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Because you said that you would kill a play before it is over - as soon as the QB's knee STARTS toward the ground. You going to do that for everyone?

For every QB that informs me he's going to take a knee, absolutely.

[amusedofficial]

I find Coughlin's comments troubling, but in keeping with the shady interpretation of ethics we see in the NFL.

After all, this is a league that thinks nothing about letting a team roll over in Week 16 if they have a playoff spot clinched, even though that game may be important to another team looking to make the playoffs. It happens every year and reflects a lack of respect for the game. Worse, it has become recognized as a smart move by coaches by a world in which winning with integrity doesn't matter.

Coughlin had his team ill-prepared for the game-ending play. The TB coach used that strategy previously in his coaching career. Coughlin should have expected he would use it as a professional since it is within the rules and happened during a one possession game.

[APG]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

I see...so basically you cheat and kill a play before it is over.

Nice.

Just IMO and take it for what it's worth, but I don't see how this could be read as anything other than implying Rich is a cheater. He's a big boy and can see fit how to handle this if he feels it needs to.

Again, there's a reason the Giants were as incensed after this tactic and a fight nearly broke out. It's simply not done in the NFL as protocol and as an "unwritten rule." If you watched any other games this Sunday, in an apparent V-formation/kneel down situation, the accepted practice was followed.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Just IMO and take it for what it's worth, but I don't see how this could be read as anything other than implying Rich is a cheater. He's a big boy and can see fit how to handle this if he feels it needs to.

Again, there's a reason the Giants were as incensed after this tactic and a fight nearly broke out. It's simply not done in the NFL as protocol and as an "unwritten rule." If you watched any other games this Sunday, in an apparent V-formation/kneel down situation, the accepted practice was followed.

At worst, he's implying Rich cuts corners, probably similar to calling a foul on a quick touch when the losing team tries to foul (with opposite results) or ignoring the little violations when a game is no longer in doubt.

More likely, (confirmed by rocky himself), it's a rhetorical point. Knowing rocky, I thought it was clearly the latter.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

At worst, he's implying Rich cuts corners, probably similar to calling a foul on a quick touch when the losing team tries to foul (with opposite results) or ignoring the little violations when a game is no longer in doubt.

More likely, (confirmed by rocky himself), it's a rhetorical point. Knowing rocky, I thought it was clearly the latter.

But he came up with a nefarious reason. We do the same as you illustrated all the time and wish I would have used that example earlier.

Peace

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

But he came up with a nefarious reason. We do the same as you illustrated all the time and wish I would have used that example earlier.

Peace

It was hyperbole.

If anything, the practice Rich noted hurts the offense, in that he eliminates the chance for a fake.