Celtics play

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Not sure I remember or were directly involved in those discussions here, but there are discussions I have had about this issue previously. But in this discussion people seem to be intent on that there was a travel and did not seem to focus on the foul that might have affected any travel being called. That is the only reason I pointed that out.

Peace

By rule, it seems pretty simple. Although in practice it won't always be that clear.

Jump shooter goes up, gets fouled, comes down, and releases his shot that goes in. Easy to give him two shots and discount the basket. Player on the floor gets pushed into a travel before he can release the shot, it's a little more complicated.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Player on the floor gets pushed into a travel before he can release the shot, it's a little more complicated.

Not if he gathered the ball & we put a lil' verbal behind the whistle. IJS

[Adam]

Originally Posted by tref

Not if he gathered the ball & we put a lil' verbal behind the whistle. IJS

By rule, it's a shooting foul but not basket. What are you "just sayin" you'd do? And how does air in the whistle help?

[twocentsworth]

block (don't understand why there's so much discussion...pretty clear - block)
travel on reception and travel prior to shot.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Jump shooter goes up, gets fouled, comes down, and releases his shot that goes in. Easy to give him two shots and discount the basket.

vs.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Player on the floor gets pushed into a travel before he can release the shot, it's a little more complicated.

Just sayin it wouldnt be complicated to award 2 shots here ^^ if we have good post-whistle fundamentals.

Never mentioned air in the whistle...

[berserkBBK]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

No time or distance is required to be given to a dribbler when trying to get in a legal position. Strictly speaking, if the player got the ball on the run, then no time or distance is required to be given. If the player jumps to grab the ball, then a defensive player must allow airborne players outside the LDB to land and stop/change direction.

Got it. Thank you... I didn't even realize this was a rule in the NBA

[berserkBBK]

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

block (don't understand why there's so much discussion...pretty clear - block)
travel on reception and travel prior to shot.

As APG said, block in the NBA based on their rule of defensive box.

However, this is a PC foul under NCAA and NFHS. Player establishes LGP and moves laterally and backwards, taking the contact in the chest.
How is this a "pretty clear - block"?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

By rule, it seems pretty simple. Although in practice it won't always be that clear.

Jump shooter goes up, gets fouled, comes down, and releases his shot that goes in. Easy to give him two shots and discount the basket. Player on the floor gets pushed into a travel before he can release the shot, it's a little more complicated.

This play is much more common than the one you just described. Actually I have never seen a situation where I had to rule on a foul shot based on the shooter already coming back to the floor an shooting the ball. The LeBron play is very common as to what is likely to be seen. I actually had to T up a coach over a discussion based on a similar play as he wanted to dispute how many steps the shooter took after clearly being fouled.

Peace

[Toren]

First play I got a travel on Wade.

I don't know NBA rules, so I'm going Fed Rules, PC after the traveling violation.

Second play, viewing it in real time, he traveled initially. I didn't see much contact as he headed to the basket, so I would have no called the rest of the play. Wasn't positive he traveled at the end, again live viewing. Which means I'm not blowing my whistle for traveling, since I'm not positive. I definitely wouldn't have called a foul, since the contact if any was marginal.

[twocentsworth]

Originally Posted by berserkBBK

As APG said, block in the NBA based on their rule of defensive box.

However, this is a PC foul under NCAA and NFHS. Player establishes LGP and moves laterally and backwards, taking the contact in the chest.
How is this a "pretty clear - block"?

I do not think the defender established LGP....this is coming from an official who calls more PC fouls than most (thanks to my: "a block is a block, a charge is a charge, and everything else in between is a charge" philosophy).

I would venture a guess that, when this play occurs in an actual game, 80-90% of officials would rule this a block.....

btw, can't see the travel that some are alleging took place. In other circumstances, too many officials rule a travel in situations like this to avoid having to call a block/charge......I think it is mainly because the don't know whether it's a block or charge - so they bail themselves out by calling a travel.

[tref]

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

btw, can't see the travel that some are alleging took place. In other circumstances, too many officials rule a travel in situations like this to avoid having to call a block/charge......I think it is mainly because the don't know whether it's a block or charge - so they bail themselves out by calling a travel.

Yeah I think travels should be like 3 seconds, in regards to NOT making that be your best call.

[berserkBBK]

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

block (don't understand why there's so much discussion...pretty clear - block)
travel on reception and travel prior to shot.

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

I would venture a guess that, when this play occurs in an actual game, 80-90% of officials would rule this a block.....

These seem contradictory but not important

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

I do not think the defender established LGP....this is coming from an official who calls more PC fouls than most (thanks to my: "a block is a block, a charge is a charge, and everything else in between is a charge" philosophy).

Looking again it is close, but he has LGP as Wade has his left foot on the ground while turning. I think it is a great defensive play and we reward him with a charge call.
I can't agree with this philosophy as I don't like guessing or making absolutes on plays we should be able to get. I have heard the saying "what did the defense do wrong?" I like that better as a teaching "saying" as it teaches to referee the defense. While we can still get plays wrong, I believe it helps to get more plays correct.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by berserkBBK

These seem contradictory but not important




Looking again it is close, but he has LGP as Wade has his left foot on the ground while turning. I think it is a great defensive play and we reward him with a charge call.
I can't agree with this philosophy as I don't like guessing or making absolutes on plays we should be able to get. I have heard the saying "what did the defense do wrong?" I like that better as a teaching "saying" as it teaches to referee the defense. While we can still get plays wrong, I believe it helps to get more plays correct.

Watching it live, I had a PC foul, without regard to the NBA difference.

BTW, APG, if you could find it, I'd like to see the play where Kevin Love got hurt against the Nuggets.

[APG]

Originally Posted by tref

Yeah I think travels should be like 3 seconds, in regards to NOT making that be your best call.

Make every type of call your best call.

[tref]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Make every type of call your best call.

True