Florida v. Louisville

[tref]

Originally Posted by Toren

Thanks for the chance

I'm sure we've all had a similar play where we pass on the first one, pass on the second one (thinking, that's marginal, but it's getting closer and closer to illegal) than the third one comes and bam we hit the defender with the foul. In this case, I felt the defender was legal on the third one, but I feel he was penalized as a culmination of the previous ones.

But when I look at the play that was penalized, the defender is legal and the offense extends a forearm. So either it's a No Call or it's Player Control, we can't penalize the defense on that play alone.

That's what I meant by "safe call"

I don't know about his particular courage, but I'm pretty sure you don't make it to that level of being a referee without courage.

Before putting a whistle on it he probably asked himself, "why did he push off?"
Then the contact by the defender that he initially deemed marginal became illegal.
I can see his focus being on the potential b/c play... twice, as opposed to the contact by the defender.

Our eyes only see what our mind tells us we are looking at.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by tref

Before putting a whistle on it he probably asked himself, "why did he push off?"
Then the contact by the defender that he initially deemed marginal became illegal.
I can see his focus being on the potential b/c play... twice, as opposed to the contact by the defender.

Our eyes only see what our mind tells us we are looking at.

But he happened to push off on the only play, in my view, where the defender was legal. Is this a good time to penalize?

[tref]

Originally Posted by Toren

But he happened to push off on the only play, in my view, where the defender was legal. Is this a good time to penalize?

In a perfect world we want to get RSBQ perimiter plays immediately. But when your mind tells your eyes to watch the division line, twice in one transition (uncommon) I can see him not getting it then asking himself "did the defender do something a fraction of a second earlier to make the offense push off?"

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Toren

But he happened to push off on the only play, in my view, where the defender was legal. Is this a good time to penalize?

Is it much different than getting the foul call a second or two later after the offensive player steps OOB or travels?

[tref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Is it much different than getting the foul call a second or two later after the offensive player steps OOB or travels?

Right, I believe that's where having a feel for the game comes into play.

If he called the p/c here, Im sure coach wouldve been like, "call the first foul!"

[Toren]

Originally Posted by tref

Right, I believe that's where having a feel for the game comes into play.

If he called the p/c here, Im sure coach wouldve been like, "call the first foul!"

Exactly! and he would have been correct. Which is why I categorized this call as the "safe' call.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Is it much different than getting the foul call a second or two later after the offensive player steps OOB or travels?

I think it's different only in the timing. If the defender pushes the offensive player 4 steps ago and then the player goes OOB, that's a little late to penalize.

I think in this play, it was also too late to penalize.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Toren

I think it's different only in the timing. If the defender pushes the offensive player 4 steps ago and then the player goes OOB, that's a little late to penalize.

I think in this play, it was also too late to penalize.

Whats with all the "late" stuff?? See the whole play & adjudicate properly.
Late & right trumps quick & wrong, all day, every day.

Originally Posted by Toren

Exactly! and he would have been correct. Which is why I categorized this call as the "safe' call.

Under the circumstances (potential b/c twice) I believe this to be a "correct" call instead of a "safe" call.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by tref

Whats with all the "late" stuff?? See the whole play & adjudicate properly.
Late & right trumps quick & wrong, all day, every day.

I agree, but there is such a thing as too late.

Originally Posted by tref

Under the circumstances (potential b/c twice) I believe this to be a "correct" call instead of a "safe" call.

I don't agree. But I can see the argument.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Toren

I agree, but there is such a thing as too late.

Example please...

Originally Posted by Toren

I don't agree. But I can see the argument.

Place yourself in Hess' shoes, you have a funky misdirection at the timeline... twice. You mean to tell me your mind isnt going to be focused on 2 feet, the ball & the line more than the contact on the offensive guy.

Flirting with the timeline & defensive pressure is always a tough play in real time.