NFHS closely guarded rule

[letemplay]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

4-10: A closely guarded situation occurs when a player in control of the ball in his/her
team’s frontcourt, is continuously guarded by any opponent who is within six feet
of the player who is holding or dribbling the ball. The distance shall be measured
from the forward foot/feet of the defender to the forward foot/feet of the ball
handler. A closely guarded count shall be terminated when the offensive player in
control of the ball gets his/her head and shoulders past the defensive player.

Considering the last part of this rule, having the head and shoulders past the defensive player, would the offensive player need to be on a path TOWARDS the basket? Would moving in a lateral direction be enough to have the count dropped, provided the dribbler is by the defender?

[letemplay]

Originally Posted by letemplay

Considering the last part of this rule, having the head and shoulders past the defensive player, would the offensive player need to be on a path TOWARDS the basket? Would moving in a lateral direction be enough to have the count dropped, provided the dribbler is by the defender?

Can anyone answer my question here?

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by letemplay

Can anyone answer my question here?

No, the count should be maintained.

The distance is measured North/South.

[Rob1968]

Originally Posted by truerookie

No, the count should be maintained.

The distance is measured North/South.

Neither 4-10 nor 9-10, nor 9.10 make reference to directional orientation on the floor.
9.10.1(a) references the sideline, and (b) makes no reference to directional orientation.
Of course, the common desire of the offense is to advance the ball towards their basket. And, however rare, it is possible for a defender to be guarding within the 6-foot spec, as the dribbler moves across the court.
Also, in a trapping defensive mode, the defender(s) may be within the 6-foot spec but not on the side of the ballhandler that is closest to the offensive goal.
Please, help me out with your statement.

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by Rob1968

Neither 4-10 nor 9-10, nor 9.10 make reference to directional orientation on the floor.
9.10.1(a) references the sideline, and (b) makes no reference to directional orientation.
Of course, the common desire of the offense is to advance the ball towards their basket. And, however rare, it is possible for a defender to be guarding within the 6-foot spec, as the dribbler moves across the court.
Also, in a trapping defensive mode, the defender(s) may be within the 6-foot spec but not on the side of the ballhandler that is closest to the offensive goal.
Please, help me out with your statement.

I interpret this as moving in attacking the basket to score. Thus, the N/S reference. If the ball handler is moving laterally and is not even attempting to attack the basket (turn the corner), I don't see a need to drop the count just because the ball handler has gotten head and shoulder past the defender.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by truerookie

No, the count should be maintained.

The distance is measured North/South.

Gotta a rule reference that says that?

Once the dribbler is head/shoulders by the defender and moving away, the count should stop, as he's no longer in his path. North/South has nothing to do with it.

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Gotta a rule reference that says that?

Once the dribbler is head/shoulders by the defender and moving away, the count should stop, as he's no longer in his path. North/South has nothing to do with it.

BBR,

the N/S reference was in relation to attacking the basket to score. An orientation aspect.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by truerookie

BBR,

the N/S reference was in relation to attacking the basket to score. An orientation aspect.

Even so, you're still wrong. If he gets head and shoulders by the defender and is moving away from him, even if he's headed to the sideline the count should cease. The defender is no longer in his path.

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Even so, you're still wrong. If he gets head and shoulders by the defender and is moving away from him, even if he's headed to the sideline the count should cease. The defender is no longer in his path.

So you telling me, I can run from sideline to sideline and as long as you for example is trailing me. But is still within the 6' radius the count should cease( because I have my head and shoulder past you) with no attempt towards the basket. I truly don't believe that is the intent of the rule.


I just may be wrong show me a casebook play to back your statement up that I am wrong.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by letemplay

Considering the last part of this rule, having the head and shoulders past the defensive player, would the offensive player need to be on a path TOWARDS the basket? Would moving in a lateral direction be enough to have the count dropped, provided the dribbler is by the defender?

Originally Posted by letemplay

Can anyone answer my question here?

If A1 is moving laterally (parallel to division line) and the defender maintained a position that would put him in the path of A1 if A1 changed direction towards the endline then yes I would keep my count. If A1 has gotten far enough ahead that he could turn the corner and the defender would be trailing then I would stop my count.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by badnewsref

if a1 is moving laterally (parallel to division line) and the defender maintained a position that would put him in the path of a1 if a1 changed direction towards the endline then yes i would keep my count. If a1 has gotten far enough ahead that he could turn the corner and the defender would be trailing then i would stop my count.

+1

[tref]

Originally Posted by letemplay

Considering the last part of this rule, having the head and shoulders past the defensive player, would the offensive player need to be on a path TOWARDS the basket?

No

Originally Posted by letemplay

Would moving in a lateral direction be enough to have the count dropped, provided the dribbler is by the defender?

Yes

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by tref

No





Yes

disagree with your yes answer on lateral guarding.

Edit: unless 'by' means past defender?

[tref]

Originally Posted by fullor30

disagree with your yes answer on lateral guarding.

Edit: unless 'by' means past defender?

I interpreted "by" as meaning head & shoulders past the defender.

[Adam]

Bottom line, I'm not dropping my count just because the dribbler retreats (thus making his head and shoulders "past" the defender). If a defender is staying between the dribbler and the basket while the dribbler goes sideways, it's going to seem as if the head and shoulders are past since the defender is maintaining an angle towards the hoop rather than directly in the dribbler's path. I'm keeping my count here, too.