Karl Hess tosses two NC State players

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I agree and I doubt that anyone really cares that much considering who Hess is and what he has accomplished. And at the end of the day, "Why did Hess do what he did?" The answer, "Because he can."

Peace

So basically it has been proven that he didn't follow protocol, and your only defense has been "You weren't there", or "You haven't been in staff meetings", etc. We don't need to have been there or sat in staff meetings, we're going off of what the ACC coordinator said, which is that Hess didn't handle it properly. Then you just give the old "Because he can". I "can" go whack a coach in my game tomorrow right off the bat without them saying anything, but it doesn't mean that I'm right. Just because you can do something doesn't mean it is correct.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by zm1283

So basically it has been proven that he didn't follow protocol, and your only defense has been "You weren't there", or "You haven't been in staff meetings", etc. We don't need to have been there or sat in staff meetings, we're going off of what the ACC coordinator said, which is that Hess didn't handle it properly. Then you just give the old "Because he can". I "can" go whack a coach in my game tomorrow right off the bat without them saying anything, but it doesn't mean that I'm right. Just because you can do something doesn't mean it is correct.

You obviously did not read this thread or my comments in total. We were talking about "we were not there" in the context of what comments got the fans/former players ejected and if they should have been ejected. That is a little different from what procedure was followed or not.

And also they said the procedure was not followed properly, not that it was Hess was totally wrong or that he did not have a reason to eject the fans. And the "Because I can" was in jest and sarcastic. Honestly there are people that can do things based on their background that others cannot. If you do not know that, then maybe you have not been around long enough. You should know how we have people that get upset over mechanics or signals that officials use not listed in the book and they do not lose anything for not following "protocol." Well that can apply here as well. Of course the ACC might not have been happy, but what are they going to do about it? And even stated that they need to re-communciate which to me means they did not do the job correctly the first time, so we have to tell everyone what that policy was to cover our behinds. If a policy is clear, then say "We made it clear to all officials what to do and Hess was wrong for not following them or ignoring them" No they have to re-communicate something that was "clear" right? Sounds to me they were not happy but not jumping off a bridge either because it was not followed to the letter.

Honestly this is much to do about nothing in the end. I have seen fans ejected the same way in HS and small college games without someone going to GM to do the dirty work. Not something I recommend, but I have seen it done and no one got upset or made a public statement.

Peace

[bowlingref]

Karl Hess is a shrink and his office is about 5 miles away for me. If you guys will take up a collection, I will go by and let him tell me during a mental session what was said. $150 an hour during the the off season is what he charges. Office closed November to April.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by zm1283

So basically it has been proven that he didn't follow protocol, and your only defense has been "You weren't there", or "You haven't been in staff meetings", etc. We don't need to have been there or sat in staff meetings, we're going off of what the ACC coordinator said, which is that Hess didn't handle it properly. Then you just give the old "Because he can". I "can" go whack a coach in my game tomorrow right off the bat without them saying anything, but it doesn't mean that I'm right. Just because you can do something doesn't mean it is correct.

He didn't follow the proper procedure. Big flip. Nowhere did they say that he was wrong in ejecting the two. They simply said he should have had game management do it instead of security.

BTW, the ACC also said the two had been previously warned by a security guard at the end of the FSU bench that if they continued to walk up behind the scorer's table and demonstrate regarding calls, they would be ejcted.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

BTW, the ACC also said the two had been previously warned by a security guard at the end of the FSU bench that if they continued to walk up behind the scorer's table and demonstrate regarding calls, they would be ejcted.

Exactly. I guarantee you it wasn't just about what they "said" ... it was what they were doing. If you are seated behind the scorer's table you can't interfere with what is going on. Sounds to me like they were being a huge distraction, were warned, didn't want to comply, and were ejected.

Do you think if it was two students at the school or two random people attending the game this would have even made ESPN? Doubt it.

The quote in this article tells me all I need to know:

"We're not denying we were all over him, but I've been doing that every game I've been at since I retired," said Corchiani, who said he attends just about every NC State game. "That's homecourt advantage."

No, Chris, that's douchebaggery.

[JetMetFan]

Just for kicks, the following is in the NC State Basketball Fan guide for the 2011-12 Season...

NC State Sportsmanship Initiative
Promoting first-class conduct from all those associated with NC State has always been the goal of the athletics department. Coaches, players, fans, staff, spirit groups, and students are all ambassadors for the University at sporting events.
We all share the responsibility of promoting good sportsmanship at games and ensuring that the next generations of Wolfpackers learn the proper way to support their team.
The “Wolfpack in the House” sportsmanship campaign is your guide to helping
create a positive and enthusiastic “game-day” atmosphere. We want everyone to understand their role in creating home court advantage, but more importantly, realizing the responsibility we all share in representing NC State and respecting all fans’ right to have fun and enjoy themselves.

Let your actions represent the best of NC State
NC State is one of the top research institutions in the country, and our alumni
and fans reflect that caliber of program
Respect our visitors and game official
Regardless of the outcome of the game, we can still show pride for our
university through our interactions with guests.
Cheer loudly, but with appropriate language
Profanity or vulgarity can be as detrimental to game atmosphere as cheering
support to your team is beneficial to it, make the right choice
Respect fellow Wolfpackers - especially young fans
The future of NC State is sitting in the stands today, our children will represent the university for years to come, let’s get them started out on the right foot.
Be positive in your support of our team, coaches, and players
There is no good reason to degrade the teams on the court, instead celebrate
the game that is taking place in front of you.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

Just for kicks, the following is in the NC State Basketball Fan guide for the 2011-12 Season...

NC State Sportsmanship Initiative
Promoting first-class conduct from all those associated with NC State has always been the goal of the athletics department. Coaches, players, fans, staff, spirit groups, and students are all ambassadors for the University at sporting events.
We all share the responsibility of promoting good sportsmanship at games and ensuring that the next generations of Wolfpackers learn the proper way to support their team.
The “Wolfpack in the House” sportsmanship campaign is your guide to helping
create a positive and enthusiastic “game-day” atmosphere. We want everyone to understand their role in creating home court advantage, but more importantly, realizing the responsibility we all share in representing NC State and respecting all fans’ right to have fun and enjoy themselves.

Let your actions represent the best of NC State
NC State is one of the top research institutions in the country, and our alumni
and fans reflect that caliber of program
Respect our visitors and game official
Regardless of the outcome of the game, we can still show pride for our
university through our interactions with guests.
Cheer loudly, but with appropriate language
Profanity or vulgarity can be as detrimental to game atmosphere as cheering
support to your team is beneficial to it, make the right choice
Respect fellow Wolfpackers - especially young fans
The future of NC State is sitting in the stands today, our children will represent the university for years to come, let’s get them started out on the right foot.
Be positive in your support of our team, coaches, and players
There is no good reason to degrade the teams on the court, instead celebrate
the game that is taking place in front of you.

This is the same stuff they read over the loudspeaker at HS games just before the fans act like idiots. They should just not bother reading it at all or make it as quick as my captains' meeting.

[mj]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

This is the same stuff they read over the loudspeaker at HS games just before the fans act like idiots. They should just not bother reading it at all or make it as quick as my captains' meeting.

Ya, this makes me laugh. It may as well be Charlie Brown's teacher reading it because no one listens.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by mj

Ya, this makes me laugh. It may as well be Charlie Brown's teacher reading it because no one listens.

I don't mind it being read. Even if just one person at that game listens to it and lets it sink in then it's a positive thing.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I don't mind it being read. Even if just one person at that game listens to it and lets it sink in then it's a positive thing.

We have players read the sportsmanship statement. Home reads the first half. Visitor reads the second half.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I don't mind it being read. Even if just one person at that game listens to it and lets it sink in then it's a positive thing.

I feel the same way. If we did not read those lines than when you took action someone would complain they did not know or were not told.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by mj

Ya, this makes me laugh. It may as well be Charlie Brown's teacher reading it because no one listens.

My favorite line is:

"The officials assigned are neutral and are licensed by the WIAA. They are assigned based on their proven ability to officiate games at this level."

At this point, I normally chuckle and tell my partner, "They don't know me very well, do they?"

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

.
BTW, the ACC also said the two had been previously warned by a security guard at the end of the FSU bench that if they continued to walk up behind the scorer's table and demonstrate regarding calls, they would be ejcted.

Actually, the ACC said that the "the policeman at the end of the FSU bench was warned that their continual excessive demonstration that incited the crowd would result in ejection."

I wonder if that warning was communicated to the two former players.

[fiasco]

My take:

Justification: We'll probably never know the exact reason Hess decided to pull the trigger. But, like others here I'm willing to give Hess the benefit of the doubt. If you're a veteran D1 official, I'd have to think you don't stick your neck out like this without good reason. I do find it laughable that Corchiani and Googs are claiming they said nothing more than "you're not doing a very good job out there." Considering that they went to Twitter moments after the incident, they've been able to frame the incident exactly in a way that absolves them of any responsibility. They've won the PR fight by a landslide.

Execution: This is where Hess failed miserably, and he's received the necessary slap on the wrist for it. Who knows if he'll miss postseason games as a result. You don't give the heave ho like he did. You don't interact with said fans like he did. Say nothing to the fan(s), go directly to game management (or the closest thing resembling game management) and let them take care of it.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by fiasco

You don't give the heave ho like he did.

Does he work baseball games in the off season?