2 or 3 points?

[Welpe]

Here's the text of 5-2-1:

A successful try, tap or thrown ball from the field by a player who is located behind the team's own 19-foot, 9-inch arc counts three points. A ball that touches the floor, a teammate inside the arc, an official, or any other goal from the field counts two points for the team into whose basket the ball is thrown.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Welpe

Here's the text of 5-2-1:

A successful try, tap or thrown ball from the field by a player who is located behind the team's own 19-foot, 9-inch arc counts three points. A ball that touches the floor, a teammate inside the arc, an official, or any other goal from the field counts two points for the team into whose basket the ball is thrown.

Everything except the defender.

Try or pass... doesnt matter.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by tref

Everything except the defender.

Try or pass... doesnt matter.

I'm also reading 4.41.4 Situation B

A1's three point try is short and below ring level when it hits the shoulder of B1 and rebounds to the backboard and through the basket.

The three-point try ended when it was obviously short and below the ring. However, since a live ball went through the basket, two points are scored.

But if it was a pass that originated outside the 3 point line by A and it hit B in the shoulder and went through the basket, then it's 3 points according to 5.2.1 situation C.

[Welpe]

I don't think 5.2.1C is intended for a thrown ball that had no chance of going in without Team B's deflection. I believe the intent of this caseplay is to show that B's touch will not nullify A's throw behind the three point line. I most certainly could be wrong though.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Toren

I'm also reading 4.41.4 Situation B

A1's three point try is short and below ring level when it hits the shoulder of B1 and rebounds to the backboard and through the basket.

The three-point try ended when it was obviously short and below the ring. However, since a live ball went through the basket, two points are scored.

But if it was a pass that originated outside the 3 point line by A and it hit B in the shoulder and went through the basket, then it's 3 points according to 5.2.1 situation C.

I believe the difference is, in one situation the defender touched the ball & in the other the ball (obviously short - try ended) touched the defender.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by tref

I believe the difference is, in one situation the defender touched the ball & in the other the ball (obviously short - try ended) touched the defender.

Good luck explaining that one to a coach. I think you are correct about the distinction though.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Toren

Good luck explaining that one to a coach. I think you are correct about the distinction though.

Once we realize the distinction between who runs the court & who runs the team, explaining tough calls to coaches require no luck whatsoever...

Its never a debate, he either buys it or he doesnt. I never hesitate to invite non-believers to the rules class in October! But I never hold class on the court Nov-Mar. IJS

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Toren

But if it was a pass that originated outside the 3 point line by A and it hit B in the shoulder and went through the basket, then it's 3 points according to 5.2.1 situation C.

You agree that a try that has clearly ended cannot be a three when it is certain that it is not successful, but you think a pass which never had a chance to go in in the first place is a 3 if deflected in?

[Toren]

Originally Posted by just another ref

You agree that a try that has clearly ended cannot be a three when it is certain that it is not successful, but you think a pass which never had a chance to go in in the first place is a 3 if deflected in?

That's how I'm reading 4.41.4 situation B and 5.2.1

[bob jenkins]

I think I misread the play originally, too.

If the original "throw" has any chance of going in the basket (there's enough force to get the ball above 9 feet and the direction will take it within 10 feet of the basket), then count it as three.

If the original "throw" has no chance, then count it as two.

The rule change was put in place to allow for a "missed alley-oop" pass to count for three points.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I think I misread the play originally, too.

If the original "throw" has any chance of going in the basket (there's enough force to get the ball above 9 feet and the direction will take it within 10 feet of the basket), then count it as three.

If the original "throw" has no chance, then count it as two.

The rule change was put in place to allow for a "missed alley-oop" pass to count for three points.

So to answer the OP
3 and 2?

[tref]

Originally Posted by Toren

So to answer the OP
3 and 2?

Depends... was it a lob over the top or a short/bounce pass into the post.