Uncalled Cheap Shots

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Fighting. Although I'm not sure about that in the NBE.

The NCAA has changed their definitions. Intentional fouls are now called flagrant fouls (flagrant 1, I believe) just like the NBA (IIRC).

The kid who put this video together is not, however, confusing the terms. As rocky said, he's just got the rule wrong (and so does this anonymous official quoted in the article).

And fighting isn't required in high school for a flagrant. "Violent or savage" is another standard.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jesse James

White won the game, 38-37.

Possibly the most surprising thing I've read in this thread yet.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by de la hoops

Situation #2: "Red, you're OOB ... White ball!"
Maybe quick enough to prevent the imminent foul????

Except that he wasn't.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Possibly the most surprising thing I've read in this thread yet.

Apparently, maybe partially because of being brutalized and intimidated, red has nobody that can score, either.

What size are the two schools, eagle? This is varsity? Can't imagine they are very big, or 34 wouldn't be on the team, let alone on the court.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by de la hoops

Situation #2: "Red, you're OOB ... White ball!"
Maybe quick enough to prevent the imminent foul????

Good thinking.................#5, I'm going to call traveling so he won't get hammered.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I have. Last season. None were flagrant, but after the first hard foul and watching him off ball, I had my radar up. In a minute of game play I personally hit him with 3 fouls (the final one intentional) and he was on the bench. He didn't come back into the game.

A few years ago, in a FB game, we had such a player. He managed to behave himself for a while, but then shoved a shooter on a layup attempt in the second quarter. Easy intentional for me.

Third quarter, same scenario unfolds, but this shooter is smaller and the defender shoves two hands through his back. My partner tossed him without hesitating.

That second foul, by itself, would have possibly been an intentional in other games; but in context, that kid needed to sit.

His parents didn't agree, however. Dad tried following us into the locker room (I found out later) and Mom called the home school (he was on the visiting team) to complain about how we had deprived her son of the right to play the next game.

[APG]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Since we covered the misuse of "flagrant" here, does anyone want to breakdown the definitions of "flagrant" in the NCAA, NBA, and FIBA rule sets?

NBA:
Flagrant foul penalty 1: A foul that involves contact that is unnecessary. If a player commits two FF1 fouls in a game, he's automatically ejected.

Flagrant foul penalty 2: A foul that involves contact that is unnecessary and excessive. It is an unsportsmanlike act and a player is automatically ejected upon confirmation from replay (FF2 is an automatic replay trigger).

NCAA:
They use similar language compared to NFHS, except intentional fouls are now known as flagrant foul 1 and flagrant fouls are now known as flagrant foul 2.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Apparently, maybe partially because of being brutalized and intimidated, red has nobody that can score, either.

What size are the two schools, eagle? This is varsity? Can't imagine they are very big, or 34 wouldn't be on the team, let alone on the court.

I'm really surprised we haven't heard from RookieDude on this. I believe he works some games there regularly.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

A few years ago, in a FB game, we had such a player. He managed to behave himself for a while, but then shoved a shooter on a layup attempt in the second quarter. Easy intentional for me.

Third quarter, same scenario unfolds, but this shooter is smaller and the defender shoves two hands through his back. My partner tossed him without hesitating.

That second foul, by itself, would have possibly been an intentional in other games; but in context, that kid needed to sit.

His parents didn't agree, however. Dad tried following us into the locker room (I found out later) and Mom called the home school (he was on the visiting team) to complain about how we had deprived her son of the right to play the next game.

Shocking the parents acted that way..............funny how it all starts at home.

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

A few years ago, in a FB game, we had such a player. He managed to behave himself for a while, but then shoved a shooter on a layup attempt in the second quarter. Easy intentional for me.

Third quarter, same scenario unfolds, but this shooter is smaller and the defender shoves two hands through his back. My partner tossed him without hesitating.

That second foul, by itself, would have possibly been an intentional in other games; but in context, that kid needed to sit.

His parents didn't agree, however. Dad tried following us into the locker room (I found out later) and Mom called the home school (he was on the visiting team) to complain about how we had deprived her son of the right to play the next game.

...and herein lies the problem.

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by tomegun

When thinking about the duties of the officials, which is why we are here, who cares what grade he is in and what his primary duties are? In this game, and I'm sure others, he is a nuisance and should have been eliminated from the contest in one way or the other.



So Chseagle, are these officials "veterans" in your area? In your opinion, how to they rate in their association. Ladies and gentlemen, for their area, these may be top officials. Sad but possibly true.

I am not being biased, as like I stated White 34 should NOT be playing at all. Why he is being allowed to play I can only speculate that his family are boosters, financially.

I am not going to throw people underneath buses, so I am not going to comment on officials within the local associations that provide services.

[grunewar]

unless of course they are in a position of authority over you and they remove you from a position........ then, feel free.

[fullor30]

What kind of coach would condone this repeated thuggery by white team?

[chseagle]

The final score of the game was 38-37 in favor of Connell. If I remember the standings right that was Connell's 1st win of the season after playing in 5 previous games.

Both schools are classified as 1A schools (208-521 students)

Connell's student count is: 391

Highland's student count is: 274

Not all the 1A schools in the WIAA District that Connell & Highland are in can field C squads, & Highland only has Boys' & Girls' JV & V Squads for basketball. Connell's only 1 of 2-3 1A schools that has all squads.

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by fullor30

What kind of coach would condone this repeated thuggery by white team?

I know the coach well as he was a player when I was Boys' Basketball Manager, this style of play was not something he did.

He teaches a well-balanced game, not a game of thuggery.

White 34 being the brute he is, should be wrestling, not playing basketball.