Is this legal?

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by DrakeM
If the dribble is "interrupted", there is no player control. I don't see that Mike's interpretation is in conflict with that.

That's true, which is the exact same thing I said above.

As long as the dribbler is "in control",
purposely leaves ball on the court to avoid a defender,then is the first to touch the ball after returning in-bounds to continue his dribble, it is illegal.

And that's not true. If the dribbler is "in control," it's a violation as soon as he steps OOB. Purposely leaving the court has absolutely nothing to do with whether a violation occurs or not. It's simply a matter of whether control exists when he touches OOB.

It is never a violation under NF rules to be the first player to touch the ball after being OOB. Such a violation does not exist.

[jking_94577]

For NCAA, can the dribble be continued after returning inbounds? As bacterium has pointed out, it looks like the NBA only lets you retrieve the ball but it does not let you continue dribbling unless one of those 3 things happen. Or is bacterium wrong because the first dribble never ended?

And another play that we used to do in the school yards before was this sitch. A1 loses the dribble. A1 is guarded by B1 so she throws it at B1. A1 then picks up the ball and regains dribble. Is this legal? According to NCAA and NBA rule book, the ball can be dribbled a second time after an opponent touches it.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by jking_94577
For NCAA, can the dribble be continued after returning inbounds? As bacterium has pointed out, it looks like the NBA only lets you retrieve the ball but it does not let you continue dribbling unless one of those 3 things happen. Or is bacterium wrong because the first dribble never ended?

NCAA -- yes, if it was an interrupted dribble and the player doesn't "catch" the ball (thus, ending the dribble). The normal dribbling rules apply -- the OOB situation has nothing to do with this.

And another play that we used to do in the school yards before was this sitch. A1 loses the dribble. A1 is guarded by B1 so she throws it at B1. A1 then picks up the ball and regains dribble. Is this legal? According to NCAA and NBA rule book, the ball can be dribbled a second time after an opponent touches it.

So, the rule book says it can be done, and you're asking if it's legal? Of course it's legal.

[jking_94577]

I guess the reason I ask about the purposely throwing it off someone is that I am surprised that this does not happen more often in the NCAA or NBA. I used to have this guy who did this all the time. It was so hard to guard him. He would never lose his dribble.

[BktBallRef]

It may work fine in the driveway but it's not as likely to be as successful when you're playing D1 or NBA ball.

[Hawks Coach]

One of the best plays of this type I saw was done by Shaunte Rogers for GW. Rogers was a 5'4" guard, and he got caught with his dribble picked up about 20-25 feet from the basket on the wing. He attempted a turnaround jumper in the face of his much larger opponent, then turned and immediately blocked out, keeping his opponent pinned on the basket side. He correctly anticipated that it would be an easy block, tossed it right up into his opponent to get it blocked, then recovered the ball when it bounded away from the basket into the area he sealed off. CREATIVE!

As for why it doesn't happen much more, there are two reasons. 1) you can't very well control what happens when you bounce it off your opponent and 2) opponents at the highest level have quick hands and can take the ball from you (yhour playground opponents just can't make the same plays!).

Remember when Iverson did the "butt-ball" inbounds on the sideline this year (Iverson catches an opponent with his back turned on an inbounds, tosses it off his backside, jumps in, grabs ball and goes for lay-up). A couple of games later, Jordan turns his back on an inbounds play and entices an opponent into attempting the same move under the basket, then whirls and grabs the ball for an easy steal. The pros become a little too slick for the playground stuff sometimes

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Hawks Coach
One of the best plays of this type I saw was done by Shaunte Rogers for GW. Rogers was a 5'4" guard, and he got caught with his dribble picked up about 20-25 feet from the basket on the wing. He attempted a turnaround jumper in the face of his much larger opponent, then turned and immediately blocked out, keeping his opponent pinned on the basket side. He correctly anticipated that it would be an easy block, tossed it right up into his opponent to get it blocked, then recovered the ball when it bounded away from the basket into the area he sealed off. CREATIVE!

I saw something like this at a summer camp. PG dribbled into the trees in the lane, went up for the shot, realized he made a mistake & tossed the ball off the big guy's chest. He caught the ball before he hit the ground & dribbled back out. Very impressive!

[Mike Burns]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

Not if the dribble is interrupted prior to going OOB.

Agreed

[Mike Burns]

Originally posted by DrakeM
As long as the dribbler is "in control",
purposely leaves ball on the court to avoid a defender,then is the first to touch the ball after returning in-bounds to continue his dribble, it is illegal.

I believe the key question here is PC.

I might not be understanding what you mean by the player "puposely leaving the ball on the court". Are we saying that this is, or is not, part of his dribble?

If the dribbler (A1) loses control of the ball by dribbling it off of his foot, and the ball rolls between the defender's legs, then A1 steps OB and comes back in to retrieve the ball, I believe it would be legal because the dribble was interrupted prior to the player stepping OB.

However,If the dribbler bounces the ball between the defenders legs while running OB to avoid contact with the defender, and then comes back in bounds and continues his dribble, then I think that would be part of the dribble (illegal).

[BktBallRef]

Many people think that for an interrupted dribble to occur, the ball has to bounce off the defender or dribbler or be knocked away from by the defender. That's not the case. Anytime the dribbler momentarily loses control of the ball, an interrupted dribble occurs.

The first key is control. But the second key is that if a violation occurs, it occurs as soon as the player steps OOB. So, if you make the call when he comes back in and touches the ball again, you've made it clear to everyone that you've blown the call.

[DrakeM]

Ok.
I'm dribbling the ball. I momentarily lose control of the ball, i then stumble out of bounds WITHOUT TOUCHING THE BALL. The ball is bouncing around on the court.
So what you're saying is that once I step out of bounds, even if I haven't touched the ball while out of bounds, you would kill the play, and call a violation on me?
Yes, it's a violation for the dribbler to step out of bounds, but you can't call a violation until he comes back in and is the first to touch the ball.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by DrakeM
Ok.
I'm dribbling the ball. I momentarily lose control of the ball, i then stumble out of bounds WITHOUT TOUCHING THE BALL. The ball is bouncing around on the court.
So what you're saying is that once I step out of bounds, even if I haven't touched the ball while out of bounds, you would kill the play, and call a violation on me?

No, Drake, that's not what we're saying. You've described an interrupted dribble -- there's no player control, so no violation for being out of bounds.

Yes, it's a violation for the dribbler to step out of bounds, but you can't call a violation until he comes back in and is the first to touch the ball.

Again, not true in HS or NCAA. A dribbler has control of the ball. IT's a violation as soon as the dribble touches OOB.

[BktBallRef]

You gotta love Bob. He watches me beat my head against the wall, post after post after post, trying to convince someone of something. Then, when he thinks my head is about to explode, he pops in and backs me up! Thanks Bob!!

As for this paly, I'll say it again.

It is not a violation under NF rules to be the first player to touch the ball after being OOB. Such a violation does not exist.

[Hawks Coach]

Originally posted by DrakeM
Ok.
I'm dribbling the ball. I momentarily lose control of the ball, i then stumble out of bounds WITHOUT TOUCHING THE BALL. The ball is bouncing around on the court.
So what you're saying is that once I step out of bounds, even if I haven't touched the ball while out of bounds, you would kill the play, and call a violation on me?
Yes, it's a violation for the dribbler to step out of bounds, but you can't call a violation until he comes back in and is the first to touch the ball.

Where do I start? First, what you describe is a momentary loss of control, therefore an interrupted dribble, and therefore no violation. So no, the whistle doesn't blow, not when you step out, and not when you step back in and retrieve the ball.

Second, as others have stated, the violation occurs when the foot hits the line, not when you step back in, if you retain control and are a dribbler at the moment you step on the line.

The classic version of this violation is you push the ball to the floor, your right foot touches the sideline, you step to your left foot which is inbounds, and the ball comes back to your hands. the violation occurred at the spot where you stepped out, not where the ball touched your hand. The violation was you stepping on the line while you were dribbling, not you touching the ball after stepping on the line.

[DrakeM]

You know how sometimes you write or say something, then you walk away and think, "Huh?"

Anyway,
I realized I was describing an interupted dribble AFTER the fact.

Thanks for pointing out my lack of brain power for a moment.