Advice on how to handle mouthy players

[Ignats75]

TWo things here from my perspective. First, I had an oldtimer tell me when I was taking the course to become a referree, "When you get to the high school level, you might want to give coaches some lee-way. That's OK. But don't give the little *******s an inch." A bit of a crumudgeon, but a bisic philosophy I have followed ever since.

I too, address it at our captain's meeting. If I am the R this is my entire speech:

"Gentlemen (or ladies). You have been chosen as captains for your leadership ability. You know who your hotheads are. If you handle them, we won't have to. I only have four rules for you. Respect the game. Respect your opponent, respect the officials and have fun. Good Luck."

If they don't know the black line is out of bounds or we are going to blow the whistle if the ball touches a support wire, they are too stupid to remember it during the game anyway. So why waste the time.

Also, as an aside (HiJack warning), I never ask for speaking captains. If I have three co-captains there I want them all working on the sportsmanship issues and with me. No need to diminish the role of two of them. I'm sure there are many who will disagree with this and I understand. My mentor was the one who gave me that advice and it made sense. Sometimes, common sense is the default way to go.

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Agree. The less said, the better. I keep my topics limited to the three that the NFHS requires me to cover, and one that my local board requires me to cover (Players properly equipped, Players wearing uniforms properly, Practice good sportsmanship, Adhere to the restrictions, as well as the privileges, of the coaching box). Four topics. End of discussion.

I will usually throw this in there too. Most of the time I just remind them to keep their jerseys tucked in. I don't usually say anything about the coaching box, but if I've never had a team before, I'll remind the coaches to communicate with us on timeouts.

[Ignats75]

Our local custom is to have the captains meeting at 12 and the coaches at 2:30

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

I too, address it at our captain's meeting. If I am the R this is my entire speech:

"Gentlemen (or ladies). You have been chosen as captains for your leadership ability. You know who your hotheads are. If you handle them, we won't have to. I only have four rules for you. Respect the game. Respect your opponent, respect the officials and have fun. Good Luck."

I like this! Might just give it a try...

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

Our local custom is to have the captains meeting at 12 and the coaches at 2:30

That wouldn't work here. Start times are at 7:30.

[Ignats75]

Originally Posted by 26 year gap

that wouldn't work here. Start times are at 7:30.

You are turning into Padgett

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

I too, address it at our captain's meeting. If I am the R this is my entire speech:

"Gentlemen (or ladies). You have been chosen as captains for your leadership ability. You know who your hotheads are. If you handle them, we won't have to. I only have four rules for you. Respect the game. Respect your opponent, respect the officials and have fun. Good Luck."

While I understand what you are saying (excuse me, I get paid to look at things this way), how are any of those measurable? If you were to say something about sportsmanship and they didn't follow it, you can call a technical foul. If they showed disrespect for you, their opponents or the game, how are you going to enforce it? Yes, it would probably fall into the sportsmanship category which means you could simply say something about...sportsmanship and be done with it. Chances are they aren't listening anyway.

As far as some of the other posts go, I don't think we should tolerate anything from kids. Our instructional chair - a fine gentleman - tells us that we can find 10 players that want to play on any given night. The others will either be eliminated systematically (5 fouls) or immediately (1 technical/flagrant foul).

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by tomegun

how are any of those measurable?

Via definitions.

I stated earlier that I would add "imperative sentences" to the list of T-able offenses. I believe that's pretty clear cut. We should never tolerate orders from anyone on the floor.

Others have used profanity and other defined terms. Granted, there are variances among some of us as to what meets these terms, but for the most part, our general knowledge (particularly in your bit of Rome) knows what they mean.

There's also good ol' "common sense," a term that sometimes makes me cringe, because some people use it when they really mean, "how come everyone doesn't think like I do?" The reality is, though, common sense plays a big role in what we do. Some of the best officials I know embrace this concept.

Nearly everything in this game is defined. Was control met here? Did he travel there? We use our definitions as our measuring sticks, and it also plays a role in what we find T-able, too.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Via definitions.

OK, let me try again by putting this in the form of a statement instead of a question. While I do believe that there is a time and a place for what I would consider motivational conversation, the statement I was asking about means nothing to players when they are about to play a game. If someone violates one of those "respects" the official has no rule reference or penalty to use. Furthermore, my common sense tells me that most actions that can be related to these "respects" would really be unsporting acts. So - I'm going to use my common sense again - why not just say something about sportsmanship and be done? Maybe not as memorable or quotable, but simpler.

I can see it now..."Technical foul on blue forty two for not respecting his opponent." Now does that make (common) sense?

Having said all of that, a respect speech may fit the person who posted it's personality. But for someone else to say they are going to use it because is sounds good may not work.

[ga314ref]

Originally Posted by tomegun

If someone violates one of those "respects" the official has no rule reference or penalty to use. Furthermore, my common sense tells me that most actions that can be related to these "respects" would really be unsporting acts. So - I'm going to use my common sense again - why not just say something about sportsmanship and be done? Maybe not as memorable or quotable, but simpler.

While your common sense is helpful for your deduction, there is a specific rules reference (10-3-6(a)) and penalty for disrespectful actions toward oficials, and (c) addresses baiting and taunting.

[Ignats75]

Beat me to it.

I expected better from you Tomegun. You don't think we should have a captain's meeting?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

Beat me to it.

I expected better from you Tomegun. You don't think we should have a captain's meeting?

Where did he say that?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

Beat me to it.

I expected better from you Tomegun. You don't think we should have a captain's meeting?

I don't think he said that, but I don't think much (anything?) would change if we didn't.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I don't think he said that, but I don't think much (anything?) would change if we didn't.

Me either. I consider it one of the least important moments I'm on the floor and I only do it because it's required of me. If it was made optional tomorrow, I'd never do one.

As far as tomegun's post -- none of this is measurable. Whether an act crosses the line is *always* subjective. I mean, even what I say is ridiculous, "I need one spokesperson from each team. (Pause to get that completely unnecessary information, although I'll ask the captain if they're ready before the jump.) You are the leaders on the floor. We expect good sportsmanship. Help us with your teammates or we'll have to get involved. Any questions?"

BTW, that's my entire captain's meeting these days. If it's over 20 seconds, my partners are going to let me know about it.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Me either. I consider it one of the least important moments I'm on the floor and I only do it because it's required of me. If it was made optional tomorrow, I'd never do one.

As far as tomegun's post -- none of this is measurable. Whether an act crosses the line is *always* subjective. I mean, even what I say is ridiculous, "I need one spokesperson from each team. (Pause to get that completely unnecessary information, although I'll ask the captain if they're ready before the jump.) You are the leaders on the floor. We expect good sportsmanship. Help us with your teammates or we'll have to get involved. Any questions?"

BTW, that's my entire captain's meeting these days. If it's over 20 seconds, my partners are going to let me know about it.

Thanks everyone for clearing this up - no, I didn't say we shouldn't have a captain's meeting. We are supposed to have one and we do it. However, Rich's post above speaks to what I feel. Some grand statement to the players means very little to nothing. Who cares about being quotable when the only people really listening are your partners?

The worst part of any game is everything we do before tip off. I try to stand there not looking bored and as un-militant as I can be, but I'm just suffering through all of that. The most excitement is if someone dunks and that isn't even really exciting; I just calmly ask for the player's number if they are wearing warm ups.