Charge/Block question

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

But how is dribbling towards the basket, back turned, a foul? At what point does the offensive player then no longer have the right to make an attempt to the basket.

Are you then saying once a defender is covering a man, all attempts to move towards the hoop are a charge? If a guy like Shaq or Dwight Howard dribble with their butt first how is that different then Kobe going straight on?

Seems to me there is no standard nor is there set way.

Sure there is - go back and read your original post..from nba.com: "If he gets to a legal position and the offensive player runs into him it is an offensive foul." Doesn't get much clearer than that....it doesn't matter if the offensive player is going forwards, backwards, sideways or turning somersaults.

You asked a question and in response have been given good and accurate information by some very experienced officials - being argumentative, especially out of ignorance won't help your case. As the title indicates, this is an officiating forum - a place where officials and interested others get together to discuss and improve our knowledge and understanding of officiating the game of basketball. Anyone interested in learning more about the sport and how it is officiated is always welcome. But as Bob indicated, for "fan-boys" -those that simply want to espouse opinions and aren't interested in the facts - there are other discussion boards that are more suitable....

Being a curious fan can be a good thing, but being an informed and knowledgeable fan is much better. If you want to be the latter, I'd suggest you spend some time learning the fundamentals and rules of basketball.

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by jurassic referee

there is a standard and set way under high school, college and international rules. The nba? Not so much.

I've been involved with basketball officiating for over 50 years and i don't have a clue what a "foul' is in the nba.

+1

[UCFGUY06]

Originally Posted by TimTaylor

Sure there is - go back and read your original post..from nba.com: "If he gets to a legal position and the offensive player runs into him it is an offensive foul." Doesn't get much clearer than that....it doesn't matter if the offensive player is going forwards, backwards, sideways or turning somersaults.

You asked a question and in response have been given good and accurate information by some very experienced officials - being argumentative, especially out of ignorance won't help your case. As the title indicates, this is an officiating forum - a place where officials and interested others get together to discuss and improve our knowledge and understanding of officiating the game of basketball. Anyone interested in learning more about the sport and how it is officiated is always welcome. But as Bob indicated, for "fan-boys" -those that simply want to espouse opinions and aren't interested in the facts - there are other discussion boards that are more suitable....

Being a curious fan can be a good thing, but being an informed and knowledgeable fan is much better. If you want to be the latter, I'd suggest you spend some time learning the fundamentals and rules of basketball.

Then as an official please tell me why Shaq, Dwight Howard, and Greg Oden at OSU were never called for charging in their careers? In the NBA, and in the NCAA this is seen all the time and is never called. So what is that reason then, is it not a foul, or special treatment?

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Then as an official please tell me why Shaq, Dwight Howard, and Greg Oden at OSU were never called for charging in their careers?

You must not watch much basketball.

Shaq is called for offensive fouls quite often. On Christmas Day, if fouled out while playing less than a full quarter. If the defender holds his ground, Shaq is routinely called for offensive fouls.

In the Magic's second playoff series last year, Dwight Howard stayed in so much foul trouble, he was irrelevant in the series. He incurs numerous technical fouls for complaining about these fouls.

Greg Oden can't stay healthy long enough to commit an offensive foul. He's the 21st century's version of Sam Bowie.

In the NBA, and in the NCAA this is seen all the time and is never called. So what is that reason then, is it not a foul, or special treatment?

Actually, it's called quite often in the NCAA. In the NBA, it's called to a lesser extent because the assoication is about entetainment, not basketball.

BTW, using words like alsways and never is a very bad idea.

[APG]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Then as an official please tell me why Shaq, Dwight Howard, and Greg Oden at OSU were never called for charging in their careers? In the NBA, and in the NCAA this is seen all the time and is never called. So what is that reason then, is it not a foul, or special treatment?

That's just a silly statement. Those guys have been called for charging fouls. Also, bob answered your question correctly in the very first post of this thread.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Because "manhandling" isn't legal.

Not even in a girl's game?

[UCFGUY06]

Here is a link to NBA Post Up's on YouTube. Sorry about the music, just mute it.

YouTube - Post Moves

Starting at 1:03 with Carmelo who uses his Butt to create space you will see there was no call. This is the stuff I'm talking about.

Also Boozer at 1:40 is the prime example of what I am referring too. That is the move Shaq and other big men have done their whole careers.

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Not even in a girl's game?

You been in the nog again?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Here is a link to NBA Post Up's on YouTube. Sorry about the music, just mute it.

YouTube - Post Moves

Starting at 1:03 with Carmelo who uses his Butt to create space you will see there was no call. This is the stuff I'm talking about.

Also Boozer at 1:40 is the prime example of what I am referring too. That is the move Shaq and other big men have done their whole careers.

CFGUY06:

If you are looking for answers as to who the rules are administered in the NBA you are asking the wrong group. While some of us stay on top of the NBA Rules, that does not mean we understand how they are applied on the court. NFHS, NCAA, and FIBA (sometimes) are our primary areas of expertise.

MTD, Sr.

P.S. How is the weather is Central Florida today?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Not even in a girl's game?

Billy:

You are a naughty naughty boy.

MTD, Sr.

[APG]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Here is a link to NBA Post Up's on YouTube. Sorry about the music, just mute it.

YouTube - Post Moves

Starting at 1:03 with Carmelo who uses his Butt to create space you will see there was no call. This is the stuff I'm talking about.

Also Boozer at 1:40 is the prime example of what I am referring too. That is the move Shaq and other big men have done their whole careers.

The play at 1:40, I have the defender "giving up ground" If a defender is going to do that, then I have nothing. The play at 1:03 is didn't see anything wrong with that. Shane is slighty off balance thus making the bump look worse than it is. The play I could see a foul called on is the play after the 1:03 with Carmelo.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Here is a link to NBA Post Up's on YouTube. Sorry about the music, just mute it.

YouTube - Post Moves

Starting at 1:03 with Carmelo who uses his Butt to create space you will see there was no call. This is the stuff I'm talking about.

Also Boozer at 1:40 is the prime example of what I am referring too. That is the move Shaq and other big men have done their whole careers.

Two separate issues:
1. What is the rule?
2. How do NBA officials enforce the rule?

You have been given the answer to #1. Nobody knows the answer to #2, so don't expect much of an answer there.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Here is a link to NBA Post Up's on YouTube. Sorry about the music, just mute it.

YouTube - Post Moves

Starting at 1:03 with Carmelo who uses his Butt to create space you will see there was no call. This is the stuff I'm talking about.

Also Boozer at 1:40 is the prime example of what I am referring too. That is the move Shaq and other big men have done their whole careers.

As we've already told you:

#1 - the defender doesn't hold his ground and gives way, he's not going to get the call in the NBA.

#2 - The NBA is entertainment, not basketball. They call it they want the league wants it called.

#3 - That does NOT mean offensive fouls are never called. You lose credibility when you post things like that.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Here is a link to NBA Post Up's on YouTube. Sorry about the music, just mute it.

YouTube - Post Moves

Starting at 1:03 with Carmelo who uses his Butt to create space you will see there was no call. This is the stuff I'm talking about.

Also Boozer at 1:40 is the prime example of what I am referring too. That is the move Shaq and other big men have done their whole careers.

In both of those examples, the officials must have determined the defender gave up his ground. But you seem to have the impression that since a player is dribbling backwards he can push his defender into the bleachers without a foul call.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by UCFGUY06

Then as an official please tell me why Shaq, Dwight Howard, and Greg Oden at OSU were never called for charging in their careers? In the NBA, and in the NCAA this is seen all the time and is never called. So what is that reason then, is it not a foul, or special treatment?

I disagree completely that it is seen and not called in the NCAA. You have no legitimate basis to make that statement.

The NBA? Don't watch it anymore and what you're moaning about is one of the reasons that I don't. That's just me though. It's certainly not representative of the thinking of any other or all amateur officials. Everybody has their own view.

The NBA is entertainment based. Colleges, high schools and international teams play basketball.