Free throw violation?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by ref3808

... After the ball has been placed at the disposal of the of the freethrower, he/she is not permitted to leave or enter the free-throw semicircle without violating, until restrictions have ended.

And..?

Does touching the floor with a hand constitute "leave(ing) or enter(ing) the free-throw semicircle"?

[DrPete]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

And..?

Does touching the floor with a hand constitute "leave(ing) or enter(ing) the free-throw semicircle"?

Yes it does. Violation on the shooter, and if this is the front end of a 1-and-1, then it counts as a miss. Defense gets to take the ball out for a spot throwin on the endline. If it was the first shot of a two or three shot free throw, then it still counts as a miss, but the shooter is allowed to attempt the remaining free throws.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by DrPete

Yes it does. Violation on the shooter....

Rule citation, please.

[Adam]

Based on the fact that they had to add the part about touching the floor in the lane to the restrictions on the non-shooters along the lane, I would say that touching the floor in the lane does not constitute leaving the marked lane space.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Based on the fact that they had to add the part about touching the floor in the lane to the restrictions on the non-shooters along the lane, I would say that touching the floor in the lane does not constitute leaving the marked lane space.

Why would you say that? IIRC, it was changed as a an editorial change...meaning it was a clarification on the existing rule rather than a change in a rule. Therefore, touching in the lane was always considered to be the same as leaving the space, but since it wasn't explicitly spelled out and some didn't read it that way, so they changed it. Touching the lane makes a player's location in the lane. If their location is in the lane, they've left the marked spot.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Based on the fact that they had to add the part about touching the floor in the lane to the restrictions on the non-shooters along the lane, I would say that touching the floor in the lane does not constitute leaving the marked lane space.

Oh?

That statement is a direct contradiction of the actual rule which says:
NFHS rule 9-1-3d..."No player shall enter a marked lane space or leave a marked lane space by contacting the court outside the the 36-inch by 36-inch space."

Methinks your thinking needs re-thinking.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Oh?

That statement is a direct contradiction of the actual rule which says:
NFHS rule 9-1-3d..."No player shall enter a marked lane space or leave a marked lane space by contacting the court outside the the 36-inch by 36-inch space."

Methinks your thinking needs re-thinking.

Snaq's point, right or wrong, is that the free throw shooter is not entering or leaving a marked lane space and is never required to be in the 36"x36" space, so this rule does not apply to him/her.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Snaq's point, right or wrong, is that the free throw shooter is not entering or leaving a marked lane space and is never required to be in the 36"x36" space, so this rule does not apply to him/her.

Um no, that logic is completely wrong. Snaqs' statement was.."I would say that touching the floor in the lane does not constitute leaving the MARKED LANE SPACE." NFHS rule 9-1-3d contradicts that statement. That was my point. There is no mention of the FT shooter in his statement, only references to marked lane spaces.

If he hadda said that touching the floor in the lane does not constitute "have either foot beyond the vertical plane of the edge of the free-throw line which is farther from the basket.." by the FT shooter, as laid out in a completely different rule (9-1-3e), then we would have a completely different discussion.

Now you tell me, Skippy.....

If a FT shooter loses his balance and touches the lane in front of his FT line with either the ball or a hand(s), is that a violation?

[Indianaref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

If a FT shooter loses his balance and touches the lane in front of his FT line with either the ball or a hand(s), is that a violation?

I could not find a violation on the FT shooter or any player located behind the 3 pt line.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Oh?

That statement is a direct contradiction of the actual rule which says:
NFHS rule 9-1-3d..."No player shall enter a marked lane space or leave a marked lane space by contacting the court outside the the 36-inch by 36-inch space."

Methinks your thinking needs re-thinking.

Apparently, my memory wasn't clear. As Camron notes, this was an editorial clarification. I need to rethink this.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Apparently, my memory wasn't clear. As Camron notes, this was an editorial clarification. I need to rethink this.

While you may have not explained it clearly, the result is the same. That editorial clarification clarified that touching the floor outside of a space you are limited to is the same as leaving that space. Being an editorial clarification, it can easily be extended to the parallel rule for the FT shooter that requires that the FT shooter not leave the semi-circle.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

While you may have not explained it clearly, the result is the same. That editorial clarification clarified that touching the floor outside of a space you are limited to is the same as leaving that space. Being an editorial clarification, it can easily be extended to the parallel rule for the FT shooter that requires that the FT shooter not leave the semi-circle.

Agreed.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

That editorial clarification clarified that touching the floor outside of a space you are limited to is the same as leaving that space. Being an editorial clarification, it can easily be extended to the parallel rule for the FT shooter that requires that the FT shooter not leave the semi-circle.

One would think so, wouldn't one.

And also for someone outside the 3-point arc not to enter the arc by touching the court inside the arc.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Apparently, my memory wasn't clear. As Camron notes, this was an editorial clarification. I need to rethink this.

Actually, it is new language in the rule book. The part about "contacting the court" isn't in the 2008-09 rule book in R9-1-3d but it's in there now. I'd check last year's but I can't find the damned thing.