You make the call

[Rich]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I don't mean this in an offensive manner, but do you officiate basketball? That is absolutely a foul!

No kidding. I can't believe anyone would try to figure out a way to not call this elbow to the chops.

[DLH17]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

No kidding. I can't believe anyone would try to figure out a way to not call this elbow to the chops.

It doesn't appear that anyone is trying to figure out a way to 'no call' this situation.

It does appear that several posters jumped on it and called it a PC foul.

Recent discussion, i.e. traveling, legitimately compromises that conclusion. And, the video clearly supports the argument.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by DLH17

It doesn't appear that anyone is trying to figure out a way to 'no call' this situation.

It does appear that several posters jumped on it and called it a PC foul.

Recent discussion, i.e. traveling, legitimately compromises that conclusion. And, the video clearly supports the argument.

Your earlier posts questioning the legitimacy of the foul made no mention of travelling as a mitigating factor. You spoke about aggressiveness and space.

[DLH17]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Your earlier posts questioning the legitimacy of the foul made no mention of travelling as a mitigating factor. You spoke about aggressiveness and space.

You are right. And, to that end, I say it's not a flagrant foul if at all. Upon looking at it more today I can see the back of the arm contact the defender knocking him backwards.

A new perspective, though, in this case BOFARMA, called attention to the pivot foot of the offensive player. I admit to getting caught up in the action up high and not even looking at the player's pivot. Once brought to my attention, it looks as though the offensive player traveled before he pivoted and "threw the elbow" at the defender's face.

Summary....I do not have a flagrant foul and it looks as if there was a traveling violation before anything else happened anyway.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by DLH17

You are right. And, to that end, I say it's not a flagrant foul if at all. Upon looking at it more today I can see the back of the arm contact the defender knocking him backwards.

A new perspective, though, in this case BOFARMA, called attention to the pivot foot of the offensive player. I admit to getting caught up in the action up high and not even looking at the player's pivot. Once brought to my attention, it looks as though the offensive player traveled before he pivoted and "threw the elbow" at the defender's face.

Summary....I do not have a flagrant foul and it looks as if there was a traveling violation before anything else happened anyway.

Sometimes, when the two are close enough you don't know which to call, the travel is the best route. Others, like the video in the OP, involve contact that is severe enough that calling the travel would be counter productive. The defender has position, and the ball handler doesn't just pivot into him, he steps through him while leading with the elbow.

Call the foul. If you think you have to do it, get the travel first but call the contact technical after that.

[Pantherdreams]

It may also be worth mentioning that I've watched the "live" version of the on court action before the whistle, and close ups and new angles a few times in row quickly. If you watch the post shot/pre whistle action the rebound action there are probably 3-4 cases of forearms/elbows wacking people in the chest or across the face or throat on this play. Or at least being swung.

I still have a foul on the play but only because this is only play in the series where it landed on the button and took someone out.