How should a newbie handle this?

[mbyron]

Part of learning to officiate is learning to deal with various kinds of partners. You learn a lot about a person when he or she makes a mistake, or when you do.

When approaching a partner about a perceived error, try to treat your partner as you'd like to be treated. Generally people are threatened less by questions rather than accusations. You're more likely to get a non-defensive hearing by pulling your partner aside and asking "Hey, are you sure the ball comes in at the division line? I thought for an intentional foul it came in at the spot nearest the foul," rather than shouting across the court, "Hey! Not there! That's totally wrong!"

What your partner does next will tell you about his or her character. Some will puff up and tell you to piss off and mind your own business; some will honestly think you're wrong but listen to you. You have to work as a team to try to get it right. Usually the more veteran official will prevail -- that's OK, and no system is perfectly reliable. Make your case and look it up when you get home. Don't claim more knowledge than you actually have.

And if a coach complains, your team is on the same page no matter whose page that is: "Coach, we talked about it and this is what we decided. We're all working hard to improve."

[Nevadaref]

I've learned that people do not like to have their mistakes pointed out.

Therefore, in your position, you are better off to let the vet do as he wishes and not even bring it up, even though it is incorrect and not right for the game.

It is unfortunate, but people will hold a grudge against you for years for correcting them.

* I know the advice given in this post is downright cowardly, but sadly it's also true.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I've learned that people do not like to have their mistakes pointed out.

Therefore, in your position, you are better off to let the vet do as he wishes and not even bring it up, even though it is incorrect and not right for the game.

It is unfortunate, but people will hold a grudge against you for years for correcting them.

* I know the advice given in this post is downright cowardly, but sadly it's also true.

Nevada,
That's exactly what I was afraid of. Again, I respect both of these officials, but what you said in your post is what made me tread lightly with each of them.
Thanks for calling it like you see it....and like it is in the real world of officiating.

[Jeremy Hohn]

I have had a simliar situation that occured in a heated district game last week. We had a "pass and crash" that occured in the first half, which by rule, is a team control foul and no free throws should be attempted. I came to my calling official and as he was reporting the foul I reminded him "team control, spot throw in" and we got it right with no lining up of free throws by mistake or clearing the lane.

Second half we have the same play, going against the other team. I tried to use the same approach to a Division 1 official and he INSISTED that we shoot because the player passed the ball. I reminded him that the rule changed, and we now have team control, but he REINSISTED and I backed down. Needless to say, the coaches after the game noticed and I wrote the apologetic email with the scanned page from the case book indicating the EXACT play and how it should be called.

It really was my fault for not putting my "R" accountable for a good pre-game and 'assuming' that because he was a 20 yr official, that he didn't need one. Heck I am a 17 yr, and still need some brushing up from the case or rule book on regular occassions. Never be "too good" or "uncoachable" regardless of what aspirations you have in officiating. I have seen many officials who thought they were "great" officials, attend 1 camp, get ripped because of how they were not working the 3 person correctly, and they never go back. Then they are the same ones that sit in meetings that are supposed to be "the cream of the association" but never crack a rule book open for 5 years and young officials continue to put them on a pedastal because they sit at the large table in front of the meeting room.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Hohn

I have had a simliar situation that occured in a heated district game last week. We had a "pass and crash" that occured in the first half, which by rule, is a team control foul and no free throws should be attempted. I came to my calling official and as he was reporting the foul I reminded him "team control, spot throw in" and we got it right with no lining up of free throws by mistake or clearing the lane.

Second half we have the same play, going against the other team. I tried to use the same approach to a Division 1 official and he INSISTED that we shoot because the player passed the ball. I reminded him that the rule changed, and we now have team control, but he REINSISTED and I backed down. Needless to say, the coaches after the game noticed and I wrote the apologetic email with the scanned page from the case book indicating the EXACT play and how it should be called.

It really was my fault for not putting my "R" accountable for a good pre-game and 'assuming' that because he was a 20 yr official, that he didn't need one. Heck I am a 17 yr, and still need some brushing up from the case or rule book on regular occassions. Never be "too good" or "uncoachable" regardless of what aspirations you have in officiating. I have seen many officials who thought they were "great" officials, attend 1 camp, get ripped because of how they were not working the 3 person correctly, and they never go back. Then they are the same ones that sit in meetings that are supposed to be "the cream of the association" but never crack a rule book open for 5 years and young officials continue to put them on a pedastal because they sit at the large table in front of the meeting room.

Good advice for a newbie to remember. Interesting story...esp. the part about your "R" accountability. One of the refs assigned to the V game that followed a recent JV game I worked related a story where he was R in a D2.
On the crew was a more experienced D2 official, there was a sitch where the R "deferred" to the more experienced guy. The R was taken to task by the evaluator (a D1 guy), privately, for not taking action/accountability as the R.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Part of learning to officiate is learning to deal with various kinds of partners. You learn a lot about a person when he or she makes a mistake, or when you do.

When approaching a partner about a perceived error, try to treat your partner as you'd like to be treated. Generally people are threatened less by questions rather than accusations. You're more likely to get a non-defensive hearing by pulling your partner aside and asking "Hey, are you sure the ball comes in at the division line? I thought for an intentional foul it came in at the spot nearest the foul," rather than shouting across the court, "Hey! Not there! That's totally wrong!"

What your partner does next will tell you about his or her character. Some will puff up and tell you to piss off and mind your own business; some will honestly think you're wrong but listen to you. You have to work as a team to try to get it right. Usually the more veteran official will prevail -- that's OK, and no system is perfectly reliable. Make your case and look it up when you get home. Don't claim more knowledge than you actually have.

And if a coach complains, your team is on the same page no matter whose page that is: "Coach, we talked about it and this is what we decided. We're all working hard to improve."

Great advice.
I like that approach...it covers all the angles, makes no one look bad, makes the crew look like they're together on whatever the call is, and gives a newbie a good safe ground for dealing with what could be a "sensitive" situation with the wrong type of veteran partner.
Thanks.