Table Doesn't Tell Officials That the Player Fouled Out

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

It happens. As evidenced here.
Names redacted in the following situation:

3-pointer from the top of the key made it a 71-66 game with 2:39 to play. But the [Xs] watched as the [Ys] struck for five straight points in a 30-second span, four by [Y1] and a free throw by [Y2], tying the game at 71-71 with 2:01 on the clock.

[X1] hit a pair of free throws as part of his 14-point fourth quarter, but [Y2] and [Y1] answered right back with back-to-back buckets, finally giving [Team Y] the lead at 75-73 with just over a minute left in the game.

Ironically, the [Ys] should never have owned the lead. [Y1] re-entered the game with 3:02 remaining, but he had committed his fifth foul earlier in the fourth. It wasn't until he picked up his sixth foul that the officials claimed responsibility for the mistake and did not punish [Team Y], so [Y1]'s six points during the 9-2 run remained a key factor.

This part is speculation. Y6 might have performed just as well. Who knows?

[chseagle]

Becuause of the oversight of not reporting the 5th foul on the player, wouldn't it be considered an administrative technical against that team's scorebook?

Being that I've had training for both scorebook & scoreboard/timer, I've learned from doing the number of games I've done to be in constant communication between the books & the scoreboard to make sure the books match the board.

My reasoning for stating that the people need to be trained better is that I've seen too many instances happen where the person doing the scorebook is not reporting the game properly, compared to the scoreboard, & vice versa.

[APG]

Originally Posted by chseagle

Becuause of the oversight of not reporting the 5th foul on the player, wouldn't it be considered an administrative technical against that team's scorebook?

Being that I've had training for both scorebook & scoreboard/timer, I've learned from doing the number of games I've done to be in constant communication between the books & the scoreboard to make sure the books match the board.

My reasoning for stating that the people need to be trained better is that I've seen too many instances happen where the person doing the scorebook is not reporting the game properly, compared to the scoreboard, & vice versa.

There is no provision in any of the codes (NFHS, NCAA, NBA) to give a technical foul because the table did not inform the officials of a player's fifth foul.

And you're absolutely correct that in a perfect world, table crew would be trained and competent, but we have to do with what we can as officials, especially at the sub-varsity level. And as Nevadaref pointed out, even at the highest levels, where people are paid to do this, mistakes happen.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by chseagle

Becuause of the oversight of not reporting the 5th foul on the player, wouldn't it be considered an administrative technical against that team's scorebook?

The official scorer is NOT considered to be associated with either team, even though the home team most likely provided the person. The scorer is a neutral member of the officiating crew, so there is no way to penalize either team for the conduct or incompetence of this person.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by chseagle

Becuause of the oversight of not reporting the 5th foul on the player, wouldn't it be considered an administrative technical against that team's scorebook?

I thought you knew all the rules based on your practice of reviewing the POEs and taking the test every year?

It's great that you take this seriously. I wish more table crews did. But, your posts here come across as being more than just a little bit full of yourself.

[Back In The Saddle]

I was at a BYU game a few years ago, the first D1 game I had been to live in a very long time. The one observation that really stuck with me was, "Wow, there were sure a lot of time outs in that game." Sure enough, the next day the news reported BYU having gotten an unnoticed extra time out. I've met their scorekeeper, he's a good guy who has done the job for a lot of years and takes it very seriously. But stuff will happen sometimes, even to the "real pros".

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I thought you knew all the rules based on your practice of reviewing the POEs and taking the test every year?

It's great that you take this seriously. I wish more table crews did. But, your posts here come across as being more than just a little bit full of yourself.

Yes, Bob I review the POEs, & the rule changes every year. However the rules clinic I view are for the General Public View. The test is not graded, nor sent into the state association like I believe it is for the coaches. I had never actually seen of the sitch happening before & had not seen any rules stating what the consequence(s) should be.

Actually I wish the test was graded & sent into the state association.