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Ball has been released. Not intentionally, I understand. But if the ball has left the designated throw-in spot, there is no way for A1 to legally recover it. I see this either as a legal play by B1 or a violation on A1 for failing to pass the ball directly onto the court.
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I swear, Gus, you'd argue with a possum. It'd be easier than arguing with you, Woodrow. Lonesome Dove |
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For me, if the ball is far enough away that A must leave the spot, then it's a violation on A. Otherwise, it's a T on B. See (new) 9.2.1B, plus the "A1 fumbles the FT" case. |
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Yes, you are correct. I was assuming A1 was leaving his/her spot to retrieve the ball.
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If the player started to throw then attempted to pull it back, fumbled, and the ball was bouncing OOB within the throwin spot, wouldn't you allow them to grab it? Take away the defender reaching across and grabbing it, are you going to call the violation on the thrower?
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Sprinkles are for winners. |
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See post #2. Yes, either 5 seconds or for stepping out of the throw-in spot.
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Cheers, mb |
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If, however, A1 can reach it without moving from the spot (quite possible if the thrower is remotely taller than a squirrel), then it's not a violation until A1 steps too far, the ball goes in bounds, or 5 seconds elapses. I'm not going to penalize A prematurely simply because B1 committed a violation. A may have recovered otherwise.
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Sprinkles are for winners. |
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The ball has left the throw-in spot. No other A player may retrieve it, and so A1 is committed to either waiting 5 seconds or to leaving the spot to retrieve the ball. I won't fudge and say that A1's fumble is a "pass not directly into the court," because it's not a pass at all. And I agree that it's fishy to penalize A "prematurely." He11, the whole case stinks, which is why we need to back up and ask who erred first. I think penalizing A is a better alternative than penalizing B, who could not have violated without A's prior error. IMO this is not the intended application of the rule prohibiting reaching across the plane during a throw in, and certainly not a garden-variety instance. Due to A1's error, A cannot legally complete the throw in here, and B preventing the actual violation does not change that fact.
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Cheers, mb |
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What is the definition of a pass? A ball that is thrown, batted, or rolled to another player. If it goes to another player, isn't that essentially a pass? Since it was on a throwin, doesn't that make it a throw-in pass? If the ball leaves the area of the thrower, I'm most likely deeming it a pass. If it bounces OOB away from the spot, then it is a throw-in violation.
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Owner/Developer of RefTown.com Commissioner, Portland Basketball Officials Association Last edited by Camron Rust; Mon Nov 09, 2009 at 10:27pm. |
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