Incidental contact ?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Pirate

Witnessed a situation recently (I was not officiating) where an official let a play continue without a whistle and was wondering how you guys/gals would call the same play?

A1 is dribbling down court, B1 comes up from behind A1 and "accidentally" steps on A1's foot causing A1 to go down and lose possession. Official let it go claiming incidental contact and thus shouldn't be called a foul. I personally see it as an advantage/disadvantage sitch and would have called the foul. Who is right?

Sounds like this guy doesn't know the definition of "incidental."

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Sounds like this guy doesn't know the definition of "incidental."

Incidental contact is contact with an opponent which is permitted and which does not constitute a foul.
ART. 1 The mere fact that contact occurs does not constitute a foul. When 10 players are moving rapidly in a limited area, some contact is certain to occur.
ART. 2 Contact, which may result when opponents are in equally favorable positions to perform normal defensive or offensive movements, should not be considered illegal, even though the contact may be severe.
ART. 3 Similarly, contact which does not hinder the opponent from participating in normal defensive or offensive movements should be considered incidental.
ART. 4 A player who is screened within his/her visual field is expected to avoid contact with the screener by stopping or going around the screener. In cases of screens outside the visual field, the opponent may make inadvertent contact with the screener, and such contact is to be ruled incidental contact, provided the screener is not displaced if he/she has the ball.
ART. 5 If, however, a player approaches an opponent from behind or from a position from which he/she has no reasonable chance to play the ball without making contact with the opponent, the responsibility is on the player in the unfavorable position.

[Nevadaref]

Last season the NCAA stated that this was one of two "absolutes" when a foul must be called.
Do a search and read some of the posts on that concept. That should help clarify this situation for you.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Last season the NCAA stated that this was one of two "absolutes" when a foul must be called.
Do a search and read some of the posts on that concept. That should help clarify this situation for you.

1. Two hands on the dribbler is a foul.
   
2. If the dribbler falls down or loses control of the ball, it is a foul (if the defender bumps or illegally contacts the dribbler).

They are on the NCAA Tape last year. I do not know if you can easily find this information anymore without registering for the new website.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Absolutes when a foul must be called.

Ball-Handler / Hand-Checking
Places both hands on a ball-handler, it is a foul.
Continuously places a hand on the ball-handler, it is a foul.
Continuously jabs a hand or forearm on a ball-handler, it is a foul.
Remember RSBQ. If the dribbler’s Rhythm, Speed, Balance, or Quickness are affected, we should have a hand-checking foul.

Post Play
Let’s not allow a defender to use a leg or knee to move a player off the block.
Let’s make sure the offensive player isn’t holding off the defender, or holding him with his off-hand.
As Lead, let’s find the post matchup as soon as possible so that we get the first foul.
Remember RIDD. Don’t let players Redirect, Impede, Displace, or Dislodge.

Intentional Fouls
Let’s make sure there is a play on the ball by the defense. If there’s no play on the ball, if the defense grabs the jersey, or pushes from behind, or bear hugs the offensive player, we should consider an intentional foul. These are not basketball plays and should be penalized as intentional.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Incidental contact is contact with an opponent which is permitted and which does not constitute a foul.

blah blah blah

yadda yadda yadda

ART. 5 If, however, a player approaches an opponent from behind or from a position from which he/she has no reasonable chance to play the ball without making contact with the opponent, the responsibility is on the player in the unfavorable position.

Bingo. From behind. No chance to play the ball. Unfavorable position. All the fixins for non-incidental contact.

This also falls under rule 11-1, "Call the obvious."

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Yada, Yada, Yada.

Has this thread turned into a Seinfeld episode?

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Has this thread turned into a Seinfeld episode?

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[Pirate]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Sounds like this guy doesn't know the definition of "incidental."

Actually, I have a rather good idea of what incidental means. Maybe not illustrated by my choice of words on my OP. I'll be more careful when posting in the future. You guys are tough.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Pirate

Actually, I have a rather good idea of what incidental means. Maybe not illustrated by my choice of words on my OP. I'll be more careful when posting in the future. You guys are tough.

I get the feeling Snaqs was talking about the official in your situation, not about you. Snaqs is mean spirited, but not that mean.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Pirate

Actually, I have a rather good idea of what incidental means. Maybe not illustrated by my choice of words on my OP. I'll be more careful when posting in the future. You guys are tough.

Welpe is right with what he writes below.

Originally Posted by Welpe

I get the feeling Snaqs was talking about the official in your situation, not about you. Snaqs is mean spirited, but not that mean.

Shut up.

[Pirate]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Welpe is right with what he writes below.



Shut up.

LOL, once again, another official (me) interprets something incorrectly. When will I ever learn????