Act of shooting

[Kelvin green]

the rule states "begins when the habitual throwing movement starts"

On a drive where does the habitual throwing motion begin? On a drive the player is dribbling, he picks up the ball to go to the basket. A throwing motion to the basket starts when he picks up the ball. The player has two choices at that point pass or shoot.... If he doesnt pass then he was shooting.

On a set shot it is pretty obvious when the shot begins. If you have a quick player the dribbles and goes into an immediate jump shot (based on my experience) most of the time throwing motion is when he gathers the ball...

The casebook clearly states continuous motion ends if there is a dribble that starts...If the player catches the ball then the dribble ends....

Looking to casebook or rule book there is no further definition of habitual throwing motion. On a layup in my mind this is clear... I like what the NBA rule book states" The act of shooting starts when, in the official’s judgment, the player has started his shooting motion" .... Bottom line this is judgment when the shooting motion starts but too often high school officials but when the definition of continuous motion in NFHS and continuation of the NBA are nearly identical..we should be pretty consistent...

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

The player has two choices at that point pass or shoot....

Or he could stop and do neither.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Or he could stop and do neither.

Really? Are you being realistic now? How many times have you seen a player dribbling on the move do this?

A player doing what the OP is doing is either going to shoot, pass, or travel. He is not going to stop on a dime. And if the player is fouled after stopping the dribble and before travelling then we as official need to judge whether he was shooting or passing. Way too often, IMO, HS officials want to make a point (often theactrically) of calling the foul "on the floor" or "before the shot" without any regard at all to continous motion or habitual throwing movement.

See the whole play.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Really? Are you being realistic now? How many times have you seen a player dribbling on the move do this?

You have never seen a player take the ball hard to the basket, then stop to let a defender fly by? Or you've never seen that same player stop, then have nowhere to go when the defender reads the play and doesn't fly by?
It happens. The majority of the time? no But it happens.

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Really? Are you being realistic now? How many times have you seen a player dribbling on the move do this?

A player doing what the OP is doing is either going to shoot, pass, or travel. He is not going to stop on a dime. And if the player is fouled after stopping the dribble and before travelling then we as official need to judge whether he was shooting or passing. Way too often, IMO, HS officials want to make a point (often theactrically) of calling the foul "on the floor" or "before the shot" without any regard at all to continous motion or habitual throwing movement.

See the whole play.

Maybe in the NBE!!!!!

Originally Posted by IREFU2

Maybe in the NBE!!!!!

1. Straight out of the HS rule book:
SECTION 11 CONTINUOUS MOTION

ART.1...Continuous motion applies to a try or tap for field goals and free throws, but it has no significance unless there is a foul by the defense during the interval which begins when the habitual throwing movement starts a try or with the touching on a tap and ends when the ball is clearly in flight.

ART.2...If an opponent fouls after a player has started a try for goal, he/she is permitted to complete the customary arm movement, and if pivoting or stepping when fouled, may complete the usual foot or body movement in any activity while holding the ball.

2. Straight out of the NCAA rule book:
SECTION 14. Continuous Motion

Continuous motion applies to a try or tap for field goals or free throws, but it has no significance unless there is a foul by the defense during the interval which begins when the habitual throwing movement starts a try or with the touching on a tap and ends when the ball is clearly in flight.

3. Straight out of the NBA Casebook:
RULE 4 - SECTION XI

46. Player A1 is fouled just as he is completing his dribble and gathering the ball. If he continues his shooting motion and scores a successful basket, how many free throws are awarded?

Since the player’s shooting motion continued and he was fouled upon gathering the ball, the basket shall count and Player A1 will receive one free throw attempt.

[Adam]

yep, they're virtually the same. I love it when you count a basket and hear, "This isn't the NBA" from the coach.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

yep, they're virtually the same. I love it when you count a basket and hear, "This isn't the NBA" from the coach.

One time, after a coach was whining to me about my partner's call, I told him that the rule is the same whether it's the NBA, college, or high school. He was incredulous.