Duke vs. Villanova

[refguy]

Anybody else notice how Villanova got their 1st 2 buckets to start the game?
The officials got a rule completely wrong in allowing the 1st basket. The official called a foul away from the ball as his teammate was in the shooting motion (the foul occurred before the shooting motion and cleared the space for the rebounder-shooter to get to the ball). By rule, you must disallow the basket as it the ball was still in the shooter's hands when the whistle blew. The next basket was clearly basket interference - they showed a replay from above the basket. Quite a way to end a scoring drought at the beginning of a game.
It would be interesting to see if any of this crew advances since missing a rule, especially one that puts points on the board in most supervisor's eyes is a suspension.

[bas2456]

You're right on with the basket interference one...Coach K finally had a legit reason to gripe!

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by refguy

Anybody else notice how Villanova got their 1st 2 buckets to start the game?
The officials got a rule completely wrong in allowing the 1st basket. The official called a foul away from the ball as his teammate was in the shooting motion (the foul occurred before the shooting motion and cleared the space for the rebounder-shooter to get to the ball). By rule, you must disallow the basket as it the ball was still in the shooter's hands when the whistle blew. The next basket was clearly basket interference - they showed a replay from above the basket. Quite a way to end a scoring drought at the beginning of a game.
It would be interesting to see if any of this crew advances since missing a rule, especially one that puts points on the board in most supervisor's eyes is a suspension.

I'm glad you started this thread as I thought they were mediocre at best. One in particular looked way over his pay grade for a stage this big. Some awful mechanics, questionable calls, and drama that made Hightower look like a freshman theater major.

I'm just so used to seeing top flight pros night after night, that this game jumped out at me. I think they are one and done.

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by refguy

Anybody else notice how Villanova got their 1st 2 buckets to start the game?
The officials got a rule completely wrong in allowing the 1st basket. The official called a foul away from the ball as his teammate was in the shooting motion (the foul occurred before the shooting motion and cleared the space for the rebounder-shooter to get to the ball). By rule, you must disallow the basket as it the ball was still in the shooter's hands when the whistle blew. The next basket was clearly basket interference - they showed a replay from above the basket. Quite a way to end a scoring drought at the beginning of a game.
It would be interesting to see if any of this crew advances since missing a rule, especially one that puts points on the board in most supervisor's eyes is a suspension.

There was a very bad basket interference call against UConn also...really bad.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by refguy

Anybody else notice how Villanova got their 1st 2 buckets to start the game?
The officials got a rule completely wrong in allowing the 1st basket. The official called a foul away from the ball as his teammate was in the shooting motion (the foul occurred before the shooting motion and cleared the space for the rebounder-shooter to get to the ball). By rule, you must disallow the basket as it the ball was still in the shooter's hands when the whistle blew. The next basket was clearly basket interference - they showed a replay from above the basket. Quite a way to end a scoring drought at the beginning of a game.
It would be interesting to see if any of this crew advances since missing a rule, especially one that puts points on the board in most supervisor's eyes is a suspension.

Actually, the player from Villanova grabbed and pulled the Duke player out the way which allowed the other 'Nova player to get the rebound in the first place. The foul came before the 'Nova even touched the ball. Definitely should have waved off the basket.

I'm not gonna criticize the missed BI because that play happened so fast and it's easy for us to say it was obvious when we have the benefit of an overhead camera.

[dahoopref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Actually, the player from Villanova grabbed and pulled the Duke player out the way which allowed the other 'Nova player to get the rebound in the first place. The foul came before the 'Nova even touched the ball. Definitely should have waved off the basket.

I saw this play too and was surprised that the basket was counted. One of the other crew members should've had a red-flag raised as to something being amiss when the calling official had an offensive foul and counted the basket. It will be interesting to see if anyone on this crew gets a Final Four assignment.

[Jay R]

Originally Posted by fullor30

I'm glad you started this thread as I thought they were mediocre at best. One in particular looked way over his pay grade for a stage this big. Some awful mechanics, questionable calls, and drama that made Hightower look like a freshman theater major.

I'm just so used to seeing top flight pros night after night, that this game jumped out at me. I think they are one and done.

I have to agree with you; these guys looked like they were in over their heads. Their names are: JD Collins, Karl Hess, Mike Stuart.

Never heard of them.

[kwv001]

Originally Posted by Jay R

I have to agree with you; these guys looked like they were in over their heads. Their names are: JD Collins, Karl Hess, Mike Stuart.

Never heard of them.

Both JD Collins and Karl Hess were final four officials last year!

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by GoodwillRef

There was a very bad basket interference call against UConn also...really bad.

There was also a held ball with the arrow favoring the shooting team immediately following an air ball and they didn't reset the shot clock.

[biz]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

There was also a held ball with the arrow favoring the shooting team immediately following an air ball and they didn't reset the shot clock.

Wow! I've never thought about that one. Team control ends on the shot attempt so it's not remaining with the team in control, therefore reset. Do I have it figured out right, Scrapper?

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

There was also a held ball with the arrow favoring the shooting team immediately following an air ball and they didn't reset the shot clock.

Why would you reset the shot clock?

[parker27]

Originally Posted by Jay R

I have to agree with you; these guys looked like they were in over their heads. Their names are: JD Collins, Karl Hess, Mike Stuart.

Never heard of them.

Never heard of them???? You must not pay much attention to the officials then. Karl Hess and J.D. Collins are all over the place during the year and during the post season. I didn't see the game, but from what you guys say there were some questionable calls....thats fine, but to say they were in over the heads is laughable.

[dahoopref]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

There was also a held ball with the arrow favoring the shooting team immediately following an air ball and they didn't reset the shot clock.

I didn't see this play but I think resetting the shot clock would only apply if the offense and defense grabbed the held ball simultaneously or if the defense had control of the ball first. If the offensive player got hold of the ball first then the shot clock stays when the held ball happened.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by dahoopref

I saw this play too and was surprised that the basket was counted. One of the other crew members should've had a red-flag raised as to something being amiss when the calling official had an offensive foul and counted the basket. It will be interesting to see if anyone on this crew gets a Final Four assignment.

One of the things I have noticed about some of the "big dog" officials over the years is their lack of communication with their partners during games. I was at the morning session of the first day games in Portland, OR, and watched one of the crews have some interesting communication problems. One of the officials tried to talk with a partner several times during dead ball situations, and the partner turned and walked away all three times! So when that partner needed some information on a call later on, there was none provided. Sounds like this was the same kind of situation - one of the partners should have come and helped out, but didn't.

And scrapper - why are we resetting on an airball if the same team keeps possession???

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by GoodwillRef

Why would you reset the shot clock?

Originally Posted by rockyroad

And scrapper - why are we resetting on an airball if the same team keeps possession???

In Men's (the Women's rule changed just this past season, I believe), you reset on any held ball, 2-11-6c. The only exceptions are:

2-11-7:

e) during team control and the arrow favors the offensive team;
i) simultaneous held ball during a throw-in and the arrow favors the throw-in team; and
j) when the ball goes out of bounds and the officials don't know who it went off of, and the arrow favors the offensive team.

So since there was no team control after the try was released, when the ball was simultaneously held by opponents, the shot clock should have reset.