throw-in bounce pass hits line

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I'm only resetting if he muffs the ball prior to gaining control. If he's holding it then it bounces; I'm not resetting.

So then you call a violation?

Devils advocate: what if it's deemed to not be a pass? A fumble is not a pass.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

So then you call a violation?

Devils advocate: what if it's deemed to not be a pass? A fumble is not a pass.

I will if it bounces inbounds or (in the case of a spot throwin) outside his three foot throwin spot.

A player fumbling the ball inbounds would be treated just like a player stepping over the line with the ball during a throwin. It's not what he did, it's what he failed to do.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I will if it bounces inbounds or (in the case of a spot throwin) outside his three foot throwin spot.

As long as the thrower has one foot over the spot, the ball bouncing outside the spot would not be a violation.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

As long as the thrower has one foot over the spot, the ball bouncing outside the spot would not be a violation.

We had a discussion about this, and I should have worded it differently. If it bounces away from where he can reach while maintaining his spot, it's a violation. You could argue that they still have the opportunity to request a timeout if the 5 second count has not expired, but given the NFHS rule/case/interp on a free thrower fumbling the ball away, I have to think they want us to call this violation immediately.

[zeedonk]

I actually had this happen to me in a B JV game I did this year while I was being evaluated by an observer in the stands. He was in the 5th row center court, and I administered the throw in right in front of him. A1 attempts to inbounds to A2, but the ball hits the sideline before A2 (or anyone else) touches it.

Tweet- "throw in violation- Red ball". That was it. Despite it being the rare occurrance, it seemed pretty logical to me- "hmm, ball hit the line, line is OOB- violation"

BTW, the observer gave me a great evaluation, complete with a specific reference to that play and two thumbs up to me for knowing the rule. I was just happy that I didn't kick the call.

End of personal horn-tooting...

Z

[HawkeyeCubP]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

We had a discussion about this, and I should have worded it differently. If it bounces away from where he can reach while maintaining his spot, it's a violation. You could argue that they still have the opportunity to request a timeout if the 5 second count has not expired, but given the NFHS rule/case/interp on a free thrower fumbling the ball away, I have to think they want us to call this violation immediately.

Don't know if this was brought up in the other thread, but there's an NCAA case play that says to reset - which was opposite of what I advocated for before I found it.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeCubP

Don't know if this was brought up in the other thread, but there's an NCAA case play that says to reset - which was opposite of what I advocated for before I found it.

I thought that was for a "muff," in which the player never gains control of the ball when the official bounces it to him.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Nope - For a fumble - So it mirrors the free throw case/rule interp. Surprised me too.

2008-09 NCAA Basketball Case Book
Throw-in
A.R. 175. A1, on a throw-in from a designated spot, fumbles. A1 leaves
the designated spot to retrieve the fumble. Is this a violation?
RULING: No. Since there was a fumble, the official shall blow his/
her whistle, which causes the ball to become dead, and then shall readminister
the throw-in.
(Rule 4-31.1 and 7-6.5)