The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 09:50am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 123
Can't make this stuff up. Tech foul

A1 is on a break away lay up. B1 is chasing from behind. As A1 goes up for the layup, B1 reaches down with both hands to A1's shorts and attempts to pull them down. B1 doesn't get a good enough tug and A1 scores the basket.
I counted the basket and gave B1 a technical foul. Opposing coach wanted an intentional foul which I don't think is right. I told B1 he was making a travesty of the game and that was what the foul was for. He didn't argue but looking in the rule book I would have probably went with 10-3-6 and just say it was an unsporting foul.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:18am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 7,620
Right, unsporting T is the way to go here. Coach wanted an intentional so that he'd get the ball under the basket. Ignore him.
__________________
Cheers,
mb
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:24am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 215
That's very interesting...and certainly a first that I've heard. I've heard of "pantsing" your friends in the interest of good-natured-humor, but never an opponent.

Hypothetically speaking, if B1 was successful, and let's take it a step further, and say B1 got the undergarments of A1 as well, exposing him for all the gym to see, I wonder if there couldn't be some kind of assault charges filed against B1? Again, assuming the act was intentional as seems to be the case from the OP...
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:31am
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 14,479
Quote:
Originally Posted by ma_ref View Post
That's very interesting...and certainly a first that I've heard. I've heard of "pantsing" your friends in the interest of good-natured-humor, but never an opponent.

Hypothetically speaking, if B1 was successful, and let's take it a step further, and say B1 got the undergarments of A1 as well, exposing him for all the gym to see, I wonder if there couldn't be some kind of assault charges filed against B1? Again, assuming the act was intentional as seems to be the case from the OP...
In your situation a flagrant foul would be in order.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:32am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,896
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
In your situation a flagrant foul would be in order.
Ditto.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:40am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 215
I'm certainly not objecting to upgrading the foul to flagrant and ejecting the player (I'm sure that could easily be justified as taunting), but I'm wondering if the my hypothetical situation could have ramifications beyond the game itself and carry over into the real world...
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:42am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,896
Quote:
Originally Posted by ma_ref View Post
I'm certainly not objecting to upgrading the foul to flagrant and ejecting the player (I'm sure that could easily be justified as taunting), but I'm wondering if the my hypothetical situation could have ramifications beyond the game itself and carry over into the real world...
I would think it certainly could.

Lesson to all officials - don't de-pants players.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:48am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 716
Quote:
Originally Posted by phansen View Post
A1 is on a break away lay up. B1 is chasing from behind. As A1 goes up for the layup, B1 reaches down with both hands to A1's shorts and attempts to pull them down. B1 doesn't get a good enough tug and A1 scores the basket.
I counted the basket and gave B1 a technical foul. Opposing coach wanted an intentional foul which I don't think is right. I told B1 he was making a travesty of the game and that was what the foul was for. He didn't argue but looking in the rule book I would have probably went with 10-3-6 and just say it was an unsporting foul.
While I was not there, based on the description I am still not sure that this foul was anything more than an intentional foul of grabbing an opponent's uniform. phansen is the only one that can answer as to whether it was clear that B1's objective was not just to foul A1, but rather to pull the shorts down for the purpose of embarassing A1 (or some other malicious intent).

My initial thought was a simple intentional foul. MByron, you MIGHT be right that the Coach B wanted intentional because of ball location, but I think his primary concern was to get more than a basket single FT out of the play. My guess is that the coach was fine with a basket, two FTs and the ball at the division line.

Something prior to this situation would have had to have tipped me off that something was in-the-brewing for me to even think flagrant foul or technical foul in this case. But, as I have stated, phansen is the only one of us who could determine intent in this situation.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 10:55am
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
I think the perpetrator's coach is the one who wanted the intentional, not the shooter's. If not, I think CMHCoach is right about the coach's intent.

This is intentional all the way, and if it led to retaliation from A1, I'd consider it flagrant.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 01:24pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: NE Ohio
Posts: 7,620
Quote:
Originally Posted by ma_ref View Post
I'm certainly not objecting to upgrading the foul to flagrant and ejecting the player (I'm sure that could easily be justified as taunting), but I'm wondering if the my hypothetical situation could have ramifications beyond the game itself and carry over into the real world...
Maybe, but that's not our department. I certainly would not discuss the matter with anyone (other than the police, if they requested an interview).
__________________
Cheers,
mb
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 01:45pm
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hell
Posts: 20,211
Quote:
Originally Posted by phansen View Post
A1 is on a break away lay up. B1 is chasing from behind. As A1 goes up for the layup, B1 reaches down with both hands to A1's shorts and attempts to pull them down. B1 doesn't get a good enough tug and A1 scores the basket.
I counted the basket and gave B1 a technical foul. Opposing coach wanted an intentional foul which I don't think is right.
Coach was right; you were wrong.

A live-ball contact foul has to be a personal foul of some kind by definition. See Rule 4-19-1. You have your choice of a common, shooting, intentional or flagrant personal foul. An intentional personal foul seems like the best option to me as the player wasn't making a legitimate attempt to play the ball(Rule 4-19-3).

Technical fouls are defined under rule 4-19-5. Note that live-ball technical fouls are by definition a non-contact foul by a player(R4-19-5).

Shoot 2 FT's with no one lined up and team A then gets a throw-in at the closest spot to B1's foul.

Rules rulz!
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 01:57pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,673
Send a message via MSN to IREFU2 Send a message via Yahoo to IREFU2
I concur
__________________
Score the Basket!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 01:59pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New York City
Posts: 322
So jumping off this thread -- what if A1 pulls down the pants (not the undergarments) of A2 (his/her teammate). Both are active in the game... I mean a warning for an untucked shirt maybe? lol But anything?

A step further, lets say the undergarments go down... indecent exposure... you got anything? I would think something but wouldn't even know where to begin! haha
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 03:26pm
certified Hot Mom tester
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: only in my own mind, such as it is
Posts: 12,918
I don't think it's that big of a deal for a player to pull off the pants of another player, as long as it's not followed by "illegal use of hands".
__________________
Yom HaShoah
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 28, 2009, 03:29pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Wasilla Ak
Posts: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Padgett View Post
I don't think it's that big of a deal for a player to pull off the pants of another player, as long as it's not followed by "illegal use of hands".
You reffs are always ruining all the fun
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tech foul is also a personal foul? Johnny Ringo Basketball 26 Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:56pm
Leaving the court--Tech Foul? Skarecrow Basketball 25 Fri Nov 28, 2008 10:43am
Tech Foul...Which comes first? blindofficial Basketball 2 Fri Feb 02, 2007 12:59am
Foul shots for tech + personal dgloeck Basketball 23 Wed Jul 05, 2000 03:16pm
Tech foul at halftime Mike Lyle Basketball 3 Sun Dec 12, 1999 11:48pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:25pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1