Coach Citing the Foul Counts

[Spence]

First year ref.

I know in general we do not respond to comments.

How far do I let a coach go with giving me the foul totals per team as in "my team has a lot and the other team doesn't have many? Do I simply not comment?

My inclination is to let it go but I'm curious as to how others handle it.

[Brad]

If they keep mentioning the foul count I will address it. Sometimes I'll just say something like "Coach, I am aware of what the foul count is." and if things continue I'll tell them that they don't need to make any further comments regarding the foul count.

Originally Posted by Spence

How far do I let a coach go with giving me the foul totals per team as in "my team has a lot and the other team doesn't have many? Do I simply not comment?

My inclination is to let it go but I'm curious as to how others handle it.

I'm cognizant of that fact, sir/ma'am... is there a question?

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

I'm cognizant of that fact, sir/ma'am... is there a question?

Do you really use the word 'cognizant'?

Yes, why what's up?

[Smitty]

That just seems like a very odd word to use when jogging past a coach...

Fair enough... works for me though

cog•ni•zant:
knowledgeable of something especially through personal experience ; also : MINDFUL
synonyms see AWARE

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

I'm cognizant of that fact, sir/ma'am... is there a question?

Originally Posted by Smitty

That just seems like a very odd word to use when jogging past a coach...

Sh!t, that's perfect when jogging past a coach. It throws them off guard and they can't come up with a quick reply. And perfectly illustrated by ref2coach's post.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Spence

First year ref.

I know in general we do not respond to comments.

How far do I let a coach go with giving me the foul totals per team as in "my team has a lot and the other team doesn't have many? Do I simply not comment?

My inclination is to let it go but I'm curious as to how others handle it.

Spence:

At this point in your career just let it go. When you get to be an old geezer like me, I will sometimes ask the coach: "And your point is?" But my recommendation is to just let it go. If the coach had any sense he would tell his players to stop fouling. But I remember a boys' H.S. JV summer league game, where the team that was getting blown out at half time had committed 18 fouls to its opponents 4 fouls. The losing coach came up to my partner and me and asked: "What am I supposed to tell my players about the foul totals?" He was obviously not happy with the officiating. I told him with a straight face: "Tell them to stop fouling." His lower jaw hit the floor and away we went to enjoy some Gatorade.

MTD, Sr.

[Scrapper1]

I have heard people say "I don't count 'em, Coach. I just call 'em." It makes your point, but it's kind of a smart-a$$ thing to say. So you might stay away from that one. Something that I have said that seems to work for me is, "Nobody knows it more than we do, Coach." That tells them that you're aware of it and that you might even "realize" that it's out of whack. (Doesn't mean you're going to try to even it out, of course. . .)

[stmaryrams]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Spence:

... I told him with a straight face: "Tell them to stop fouling." His lower jaw hit the floor ...

MTD, Sr.

I had a similar discussion with a coach a few years back. I said the same thing to the coach and during his time out he tells the players "you've got to stop fouling!" Priceless

Also had the game with two differing styles - One team driving the lane, the other shooting 3 point shots against a packed in zone. Needless to say, the team driving was getting fouled more often. Coach upset and complains. I tell him, coach the other team is just sitting back and you team is grasping at players as they drive to the basket, hence more fouls.

[Berkut]

I've always wondered why the foul count is so special that it lack of balance is somehow indicative of....something?

If the score count isout of whack, does that mean someone isn't doing a good job of calling made baskets?

If one team has 5 travels, and the other only 2, does that mean something is wrong with the travel calls?

If one team gets more rebounds, is that something that the officials should address?

Why are *fouls* the one stat in the game that coaches/players/fans think *ought to be* balanced in some fashion?

[youngump]

Originally Posted by Berkut

I've always wondered why the foul count is so special that it lack of balance is somehow indicative of....something?

If the score count isout of whack, does that mean someone isn't doing a good job of calling made baskets?

If one team has 5 travels, and the other only 2, does that mean something is wrong with the travel calls?

If one team gets more rebounds, is that something that the officials should address?

Why are *fouls* the one stat in the game that coaches/players/fans think *ought to be* balanced in some fashion?

To the first, it may be indicative of unintentionally or intentionally partial officiating. It's often a false positive though because it may also indicate an imbalance of playing skills.
To the second, no. This is indicative of an imbalance of offensive execution.
To the third, depends. If both teams are traveling the same amount then yes. Otherwise no.
To the fourth, depends. Are they attaining those rebounds by gaining an advantage not intended by rule?
To the fifth, fouls are on the scoreboard. Even the most casual fan can look up and notice huge imbalances. Most of those casual fans can't tell if the playing styles are imbalanced. Hence, you're likely to get grilled for the sins of lesser officials.
________
How To Roll A Joint

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by Berkut

I've always wondered why the foul count is so special that it lack of balance is somehow indicative of....something?

If the score count is out of whack, does that mean someone isn't doing a good job of calling made baskets?

If one team has 5 travels, and the other only 2, does that mean something is wrong with the travel calls?

If one team gets more rebounds, is that something that the officials should address?

Why are *fouls* the one stat in the game that coaches/players/fans think *ought to be* balanced in some fashion?

Originally Posted by youngump

To the first, it may be indicative of unintentionally or intentionally partial officiating. It's often a false positive though because it may also indicate an imbalance of playing skills.
To the second, no. This is indicative of an imbalance of offensive execution.
To the third, depends. If both teams are traveling the same amount then yes. Otherwise no.
To the fourth, depends. Are they attaining those rebounds by gaining an advantage not intended by rule?
To the fifth, fouls are on the scoreboard. Even the most casual fan can look up and notice huge imbalances. Most of those casual fans can't tell if the playing styles are imbalanced. Hence, you're likely to get grilled for the sins of lesser officials.

Youngump,
I think that you are missing the point. We don't here the comment, "hey, ref, come on, the score is 10 - 2, call it even" or ""wow, we have been called for 10 travel calls and they have only be called for 2 -- let's call it both ways", or "they have outrebounded us 10 - 2 now, come on ref, even it out."

We hear about the foul imbalance because it is on the scoreboard AND/OR in the book AND, for some reason, some coaches feel as though there is some unwritten rule that indicates this one statistic should somehow be close to even during the game without regard to the circumstances within the game.

[muxbule]

Coach "Boy the foul count is 7-2 against us"
Me "Which fouls do you think you didn't deserve"