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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 11:26am
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Is this correct?

Working a youth tournament over the weekend- inbounds pass at half court. Player catches in frontcourt steps to backcourt. Call over and back. My partner at halftimes says to me- did you realize you can't have over and back on an inbounds. He is a solid veteran who said till the week before never realized this as well. He said he looked it up and found this info. I have not had a chance to look up but if someone tells me this is correct please refernce for me. Thanks
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 11:31am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
working a youth tournament over the weekend- inbounds pass at half court. Player catches in frontcourt steps to backcourt. Call over and back. My partner at halftimes says to me- did you realize you can't have over and back on an inbounds. He is a solid veteran who said till the week before never realized this as well. He said he looked it up and found this info. I have not had a chance to look up but if someone tells me this is correct please refernce for me. Thanks
9.9.1
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 12:29pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
Player catches in frontcourt steps to backcourt.
Sounds like traveling to me, if he meant stepped with both feet.

Actually, it isn't clear if he means the player was airborne when he caught the ball and landed in backcourt (no violation on a throw-in) or if he caught the ball while standing in frontcourt then stepped into the backcourt while dribbling (violation) or if he caught the ball while standing in frontcourt then just picked up his non-pivot foot and touched it into the backcourt (newbies, what's the call here?).
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 01:10pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
Working a youth tournament over the weekend- inbounds pass at half court. Player catches in frontcourt steps to backcourt. Call over and back. My partner at halftimes says to me- did you realize you can't have over and back on an inbounds. He is a solid veteran who said till the week before never realized this as well. He said he looked it up and found this info. I have not had a chance to look up but if someone tells me this is correct please refernce for me. Thanks
Inbounds pass at half court----no team control yet, cannot have BC violation
Player catches in frontcourt---team control is established, player location is established, throw-in (inbounds) is ended. All special inbounding/BC rules are gone.
steps to backcourt---BC violation
Call over and back---correct call
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 01:46pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
Working a youth tournament over the weekend- inbounds pass at half court. Player catches in frontcourt steps to backcourt. Call over and back. My partner at halftimes says to me- did you realize you can't have over and back on an inbounds. He is a solid veteran who said till the week before never realized this as well. He said he looked it up and found this info. I have not had a chance to look up but if someone tells me this is correct please refernce for me. Thanks
give us a little beter description of this because it could be a back court violation.
while the player would be allowed to land one foot in each court if airborne for the purposes of saftey ot in one motion they are okay, 9.9-3.
If the player lands in the front court in control and then steps into the backcourt it is clearly a violation.
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 02:12pm
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Ncaa 4.3-8

Art. 8. After a jump ball or during a throw-in, the player in his/her front court, who makes the initial touch on the ball while both feet are off the playing court, may be the first to secure control of the ball and land with one or both feet in the back court. It makes no difference if the first foot down was in the front or back court.

this is a little better wording as far as the landing part of the back court issue
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 06:25pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
Working a youth tournament over the weekend- inbounds pass at half court. Player catches in frontcourt steps to backcourt. Call over and back. My partner at halftimes says to me- did you realize you can't have over and back on an inbounds. He is a solid veteran who said till the week before never realized this as well. He said he looked it up and found this info. I have not had a chance to look up but if someone tells me this is correct please refernce for me. Thanks
Your "solid veteran" partner is wrong. Why am I not surprised?

Here is the play ruling that mick noted:

FRONTCOURT– BACKCOURT
9.9.1 SITUATION A:
A1 catches the throw-in pass with one foot on the floor in A's frontcourt and the other foot not touching the floor. The non-pivot foot then comes down in A's backcourt. RULING: Violation. Team control is established in A's frontcourt when A1 catches the throw-in pass. The violation occurs when A1 subsequently touches the backcourt with the non-pivot foot. (4-12-6; 9-9-3)

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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 09:12pm
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Another Myth Bites The Dust ...

During a throwin, or jump ball, any player; or a defensive player, in making a steal; may legally jump from his or her frontcourt, secure control of the ball with both feet off the floor, and return to the floor with one or both feet in the backcourt. The player may make a normal landing and it makes no difference whether the first foot down is in the frontcourt or the backcourt. These three situations are not backcourt violations.
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 09:29pm
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Is it a Myth or just a mythtake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
During a throwin, or jump ball, any player; or a defensive player, in making a steal; may legally jump from his or her frontcourt, secure control of the ball with both feet off the floor, and return to the floor with one or both feet in the backcourt. The player may make a normal landing and it makes no difference whether the first foot down is in the frontcourt or the backcourt. These three situations are not backcourt violations.
Billy, I don't think the OP represents a myth. To me, in order to be a myth, it has to be a widely held misconception. In the OP, the official needs to look up when a throwin ends. He's right that you can't have a backcourt violation during a throwin; he's just wrong about when the throwin ends.
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 09:41pm
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Let's add this...

Offensive player is being pressure by D in FC moving toward BC...throw in come from sideline and is tapped by offensive player and ball goes to BC where he runs and gaines control.

BC violation or no?
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 09:49pm
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No. While the throwin was over, team control was never established in the FC. In order to call a legitimate BC violation, the ball must have FC status while team control is in effect. FWIW, without team control FC/BC status are meaningless; they are dependent upon team control.
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 10:10pm
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Is this correct?

I understand there is no backcourt violation during/after the throw-in, but want to make sure I'm right on when team control, player control, and front-court/backcourt status is established.

During a throwin, A2 jumps from his frontcourt, catches the ball in mid-air, and lands in his backcourt.

- When A2 secures the ball in mid-air:
* The throw in ends (actually ends as soon as A2 touches the ball, it
doesn't have to be secured.)
* Team A has team control
* A2 has player control
* A2 has front-court status while in the air, and has back-court status
when he lands in the back-court.

- No backcourt violation because A1 caught the ball while both feet were in the air, and Team A was not in control immediately before he caught the pass.

Is this all correct?
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 10:11pm
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The OP is unclear

did the player catch the ball with one foot on the floor then step in the back court, Clearly violation.
if the player was airborne caught the ball then the player has the right to land and can not be called for a back court violation if one foot lands in either court in any order.

But the throw in ends when the ball is legally touched on the court which would be when the ball is touched and the players foot is on the floor.

The exception here is that the airborne player is allowed to land getting both feet down safely.

I do agree with Snaqs it is the fact that once the ball is legally touched on the floor the throw in is over then the violation occurs.
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 10:28pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS View Post
I understand there is no backcourt violation during/after the throw-in, but want to make sure I'm right on when team control, player control, and front-court/backcourt status is established.

During a throwin, A2 jumps from his frontcourt, catches the ball in mid-air, and lands in his backcourt.

- When A2 secures the ball in mid-air:
* The throw in ends (actually ends as soon as A2 touches the ball, it
doesn't have to be secured.)
* Team A has team control
* A2 has player control
* A2 has front-court status while in the air, and has back-court status
when he lands in the back-court.

- No backcourt violation because A1 caught the ball while both feet were in the air, and Team A was not in control immediately before he caught the pass.

Is this all correct?
Yes, that is all correct. The only reason that what you describe is not a violation is because there is a specific rule which allows for an exception to the normal backcourt provisions.
The concepts of player control, team control, when the throw-in ends, and fc/bc status remain consistent throughout the game.
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Old Mon Nov 10, 2008, 10:29pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
FWIW, without team control FC/BC status are meaningless; they are dependent upon team control.
What exactly do you mean by that?
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