Ramifications for requesting too many timeouts

[Coach Bill]

We're playing in a fall league, getting ready for the high school season. NFHS rules, except for running clock, which I hate.

I'm not concerned with winning these games. The thing I'm most interested in, is developing these kids, getting them to work on their games.

I've got 10 kids on the bench and with the running clock it seems like the games are over in 5 minutes and none of them have gotten to play much.

This last game was particularly frustrating. The other coach seemed to be "taking advantage" of the running clock. Subbed at every dead ball. My kids barely broke a sweat in either half.

My question is: After I run out of timeouts, what are the ramifications if I call a timeout at every dead ball, in which it is their ball anyway? I know it's a technical, and they get the ball at half-court, but will I be ejected after two of them? Are there any other ramifications? Is there a point where the refs will kick my @ss? I doubt I will have the guts to do this, but I was just curious, after I was thinking what a waste of time that last game was.

[Adam]

Coach, no ramifications other than the technical foul called. It's a team technical, and thus a team foul. Nothing gets assessed to the head coach, however.

That being said, I can't guarantee the refs for your game would know this rule correctly. It's possible, particularly at lower levels, the refs may think it should get assessed to the head coach. If that happens, you could get ejected after two of them.

[grunewar]

Now why would you even think of compounding the problem and adding to the frustration of you and so many others? You're going to prolong the game and not teach the kids right from wrong (although the other coach is doing nothing "technically wrong" by rule) - let it go and take the high ground. Besides, who knows what the refs at this level might do? (nothing against them, just a question as I don't know the level of official).

[Adam]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Now why would you even think of compounding the problem and adding to the frustration of you and so many others? You're going to prolong the game and not teach the kids right from wrong (although the other coach is doing nothing "technically wrong" by rule) - let it go and take the high ground. Besides, who knows what the refs at this level might do? (nothing against them, just a question as I don't know the level of official).

Curious, I'm not following your logic.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by Coach Bill

The thing I'm most interested in, is developing these kids, getting them to work on their games.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Curious, I'm not following your logic.

Snaq's as a coach too, my thought process was - if a coach (adult) constantly did this, what is the lesson he is teaching the kids? Why would a coach do this? What purpose would it serve? As was stated, wouldn't these actions turn the game into farse? The OP specifically says he wants to "develop these kids." I just don't feel these types of coaching actions would be along those lines. JMO

[Adam]

I'm not sure I see the problem. The rules allow for excessive timeouts at the cost of a T. He's not doing anything unethical here.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I'm not sure I see the problem. The rules allow for excessive timeouts at the cost of a T. He's not doing anything unethical here.

Yeah, but he could turn the game into a travesty if he is just trying to be indifferent by continuously calling timeouts when he clearly does not have one. I do not think we should be encouraging that behavior and assume that others might not have a problem with it. And the referee in any game has the right to rule on anything not specifically covered in the rules.

Peace

[Coach Bill]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Snaq's as a coach too, my thought process was - if a coach (adult) constantly did this, what is the lesson he is teaching the kids? Why would a coach do this? What purpose would it serve? As was stated, wouldn't these actions turn the game into farse? The OP specifically says he wants to "develop these kids." I just don't feel these types of coaching actions would be along those lines. JMO

The purpose served would be to get my kids to break a sweat. Grunewar - since you're a coach, would you be interested in playing a game where the kids run up and down the court five times, have halftime, run up and down the court 5 times, and then shake hands and go home?

I'm exaggerating a little, but it was like that, with all the subs and free throws.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by Coach Bill

The purpose served would be to get my kids to break a sweat. Grunewar - since you're a coach, would you be interested in playing a game where the kids run up and down the court five times, have halftime, run up and down the court 5 times, and then shake hands and go home?

I'm exaggerating a little, but it was like that, with all the subs and free throws.

Coach Bill - I certainly appreciate your predicament and don’t know how I would react in your shoes. I’d sure as heck be frustrated too. I just don’t believe I would use your tactic.

I ref in one rec league with a running clock and ref and coach in another with 5/6/7 min quarters (depending on the age) and I like the running clock better for many reasons.

One of the biggest problems I’ve had as a ref in the leagues is teams not honoring the “you must play a quarter” or “five straight minutes” rule. Refs are specifically instructed not to get involved with these admin rules (other than to warn) as we have other issues to concern ourselves with – we instruct the offended coach to take it up with the league.

As a coach, I would probably let the game run its course, maybe say something to the coach after the game, and take it up with the league…..and hope we don’t play that team later in the yr or repetitively over the yr – as then your season would really be bad if he continues this tactic.

PS – IMO, this pales in comparison to the coach who instructs his team to pick up the full court press and keep it on when their up by 30 points and there is no mercy rule.

Good luck!

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Curious, I'm not following your logic.

You saved me some typing.........and agree on your follow up.

[Coach Bill]

[/B]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Now why would you even think of compounding the problem and adding to the frustration of you and so many others? "You're going to prolong the game" and not teach the kids right from wrong" (although the other coach is doing nothing "technically wrong" by rule) - let it go and take the high ground. Besides, who knows what the refs at this level might do? (nothing against them, just a question as I don't know the level of official).

I don't think the other coach is doing anything wrong. Nothing against him. It's just that I asked the league rep if this was a stopped clock league (answer - yes), and we sent in our money, and come to find out, it's a running clock league. And, too late to enter another league. My choices are grin and bear it, ask for my money back and quit, or start racking up team technicals. I'm 99% sure, it's grin and bear it.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Coach Bill

[/b]

I don't think the other coach is doing anything wrong. Nothing against him. It's just that I asked the league rep if this was a stopped clock league (answer - yes), and we sent in our money, and come to find out, it's a running clock league. And, too late to enter another league. My choices are grin and bear it, ask for my money back and quit, or start racking up team technicals. I'm 99% sure, it's grin and bear it.

Agreed. They've got a running clock so they can get all the games in. You might get away with it once but after that, they're just going to tell the offiicals to ignore the excessive TO requests.

[JRutledge]

I guess you would have to ask your league what the ultimate ramifications would be. If all you are using is NF rules, then your team would be assessed a T not you personally as a coach. And I guess at some point someone might think you are making a travesty of the game. You are really going to have to discuss this with the people you live around. They would know more about how the league will view this and likely what their officials might do.

Peace

[ChrisSportsFan]

Coach, your game officials are make less than half the money which they would make during the season for a stopped clock game which would usually last about 1 hour 15 minutes including a 10 minute half time and all. These running clock games typically have a stopped clock in the last 2 minutes and sometime the last 2 of both halves and the games still run about 55 minutes. Just something to think of.
You could also tell some of the players who won't play during the season that the game is in another gym so only the 6 or 7 players you want show up. Then there is pleanty of time for everyone.