Correctable error situation?

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Two words...Bull Pucky.

The sun comes up in the east and coaches complain about calls that go against their team. It comes with the territory. If you're surprised, on your heels and unprepared to deal with it, then you've either been an official for about 48 minutes or you're in the wrong avocation to start with.

Two words...what Scrappy said

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Respectfully disagree. When an official makes an obvious blunder, such as this CE situation, they need to be mentally prepared to deal with a "Norv Turner" type reaction once you explain the ruling to them. We and they (officials & coaches) are human. And you cannot treat every situation as "oh, that's just a coach whining". If we f**k up we have to prepare to catch some extra flack. And there is a difference between "catching flack" and letting a coach sh!t all over you.

I must be missing something. Where above does it say that the official screwed up on the play being discussed? how do you know that it wasn't a table error? Most correctable errors are in my experience.

You'd better be prepared to catch flak on every single call that you make, and especially on the tough ones that you absolutely nail. You never know what is going to set any coach or player off. It's just the nature of the beast. And if it happens, you deal with it. Shrug.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

You've been a ref so long that your awareness of what's coming next is second nature. Not all refs have gotten there yet.

Two words for you too....bull pucky.

If I knew what was coming next, I'd be a rich man..... and I'd be able to hire someone to read this forum for me....and respond accordingly.

Anybody that's officiated for longer than a minute and a half better damn well be prepared for a negative response to every single call...or non-call....that they make. If that's really surprising to anybody, then they haven't officiated for very long or they ain't the sharpest knife in the drawer. You don't have to develop Game Management skills to figger that out.

JMCO.

[jdmara]

Wouldn't preventative officiating dictate that you bring both coaches together in this situation and explain the circumstances and ruling? I personally have never administered a CE but in my small mind, I would bring both coaches together, explain the situation, and then brace for Team B's coach to vent a little bit. It doesn't matter who's fault it is, the officials are going to be the one to take the heat, in my experience. Anyways, administratively how would you all handle a CE? Talk with both coaches together?

-Josh

Originally Posted by jdmara

Anyways, administratively how would you all handle a CE? Talk with both coaches together?

-Josh

Yep, I think it's better to give the exact same ruling to both parties in front of a witness (table) all at once.

[jdmara]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

Yep, I think it's better to give the exact same ruling to both parties in front of a witness (table) all at once.

Appreciate the affirmation. It's bound to happen sometime but to this date, knock on wood, it's been eluded.

-Josh

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by jdmara

Wouldn't preventative officiating dictate that you bring both coaches together in this situation and explain the circumstances and ruling? I personally have never administered a CE but in my small mind, I would bring both coaches together, explain the situation, and then brace for Team B's coach to vent a little bit. It doesn't matter who's fault it is, the officials are going to be the one to take the heat, in my experience. Anyways, administratively how would you all handle a CE? Talk with both coaches together?

-Josh

Depends on the CE. If it's something really obvious, like the table buzzing you that it shoulda been 1 n 1 while your administering the throw-in, then I wouldn't bother with the coaches unless they raise a question. Something more complicated, especially if we're going to have to do the POI thing and somebody's gonna get hosed...yeah, I'd be talking to the coaches. Together.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Um, no, that's the absolute last thing that you should consider when you make any proper, correct, have-to-get-right call.

Aamof, whether a coach is gonna be happy or not should never be a consideration in any call.

Never consider.....you'll go blind.

Bad choice of words imo, Snaqs......

Okay, okay. I've gone back and fixed the original. I did not mean "consider" as in, "when making the decision, consider this...." No, I simply meant an official should "be aware" of what's coming next. B's coach here is going to be more unhappy and more vocal than if he thinks you missed a travel violation or a foul. A mistake is made, and he doesn't give a crap whether it's the officials' fault or the table. It's all the same to him, and to him, it's the officials' fault. CEs are just what they say, errors. They're messy.

This particular one is, aside from end-of-game CE scenarios, probably the worst. Make the ruling properly, and know you'll have a snippy coach for a bit. Know it so you can deal with it accordingly. I would have thought it was obvious from what I orginally wrote, but I fixed it just in case.

Furthermore, BNR states it well:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

When an official makes an obvious blunder, such as this CE situation, they need to be mentally prepared to deal with a "Norv Turner" type reaction once you explain the ruling to them. We and they (officials & coaches) are human. And you cannot treat every situation as "oh, that's just a coach whining". If we f**k up we have to prepare to catch some extra flack. And there is a difference between "catching flack" and letting a coach sh!t all over you.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Okay, okay. I've gone back and fixed the original. I did not mean "consider" as in, "when making the decision, consider this...." No, I simply meant an official should "be aware" of what's coming next. B's coach here is going to be more unhappy and more vocal than if he thinks you missed a travel violation or a foul. A mistake is made, and he doesn't give a crap whether it's the officials' fault or the table. It's all the same to him, and to him, it's the officials' fault.

That's just about what I thought you meant. You can certainly "be aware" of the consequences of a call. At no point though, are you ever going to "consider" those consequences" before making that call.

You are never going to "consider" making any other call than your originally intended call.

That was my only real point....and I think that you got it. And I think that I now get your point also. and I agree with it too (fwiw).

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

That was my only real point....and I think that you got it. And I think that I now get your point also. and I agree with it too (fwiw).

I figured you were just picking on my sentence structure or something.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I figured you were just picking on my sentence structure or something.

Actually I was picking on your word selection. i know you too well to consider that you actually meant the context of the word that you originally used.

That and me also forgetting to take my Metamucil this morning, of course.....

It's comforting to know that I can still hide my own Easter eggs though.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Actually I was picking on your word selection.

I'll just have to adjust my signature again.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

I must be missing something. Where above does it say that the official screwed up on the play being discussed? how do you know that it wasn't a table error? Most correctable errors are in my experience.

The table didn't disallow the basket and put the time back on the clock, did they?