Working with rookie officials & break-away lay-ups

[Raymond]

Dan, so that we can stay on topic and not annoy anyone (nor be called members of a peanut gallery) I'm starting a new thread, but with 2 topics.

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Whether I call the travel as C following the play to the basket does not depend on the skill level of my partner who missed the call.

Warning! Warning! Exaggerated example to follow--
Are you saying you would call a game exactly the same if you were working with Jim Burr and Ted Valentine as you would you would if you were working a game with a inexperienced U2 involved in his 1st big HS rivalry game? I think my field of vision and coverage expand just a little bit in the 2nd situation.

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

I would definitely not call a travel from HC as C in this sitch or (probably) any other sitch...

...

btw... I'm not even sure I agree with you that the C should not go below HC in this sitch. But that's yet another discussion.

Yeah, but we're not discussing following a play (offense v. defense) to the basket, at least I'm not. I'm talking about a 1-on-0 break-away like in the situation I posed earlier in which I did call a travel as the Lead.

I'm not coming across half-court unless a pack of players make their way there or until team B inbounds the subsequent made basket and there is pressure.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Dan, so that we can stay on topic and not annoy anyone (nor be called members of a peanut gallery) I'm starting a new thread, but with 2 topics.



Warning! Warning! Exaggerated example to follow--
Are you saying you would call a game exactly the same if you were working with Jim Burr and Ted Valentine as you would you would if you were working a game with a U2 experiencing his 1st big HS rivalry? I think my field of vision and coverage expand a little bit in the 2nd situation.

Are you kidding? If I'm working with Burr & TV why would I change the game I call that got me there? If I see something that needs to be called I'll call it. Which btw is NOT the same as saying I'll call everything I see. On your second situation, all I can say is I'll trust that green U2 until he gave me a damn good reason to not trust him (just like Burr & TV would trust me in my big game with them). Would I grab a travel standing at midcourt from the green U2 in this case? No way, no how.

Yeah, but we're not discussing following a play (offense v. defense) to the basket, at least I'm not. I'm talking about a 1-on-0 break-away like in the situation I posed earlier in which I did call a travel as the Lead.

I'm not coming across half-court unless a pack of players make their way there or until team B inbounds the subsequent made basket and there is pressure.

And in that case you are way out of position to make any good call. OTOH I'll be at the FT line just in case, where I can monitor both the play & the stragglers.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

...
And in that case you are way out of position to make any good call. OTOH I'll be at the FT line just in case, where I can monitor both the play & the stragglers.

No way I'm coming all the way to the free throw line on a 1-on-0 break-away as the C if nobody else has made it past half-court. I choose to stick with the stragglers.

BTW, I wouldn't change the way I call if I were with Jim Burr & TV either. I'm saying I MAY have to change the way I call if I'm with a green U2.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

1) Are you saying you would call a game exactly the same if you were working with Jim Burr and Ted Valentine as you would you would if you were working a game with a U2 experiencing his 1st big HS rivalry? I think my field of vision and coverage expand a little bit in the 2nd situation.

2) I'm talking about a 1-on-0 break-away like in the situation I posed earlier in which I did call a travel as the Lead. I'm not coming across half-court unless a pack of players make their way there or until team B inbounds the subsequent made basket and there is pressure.

1) I think that the situation should dictate whether you should help out more than who your partner(s) are. If you're the C, what do you really have to watch? The trail should be able to pick up anything equally blatant behind the play....and if it ain't blatant and doesn't affect the play, it shouldn't be called anyway. If it's out-and-out blatant, forget about partners, areas, etc. Just go get it. If it isn't blatant, let the official whose primary it's in take care of it. Jmo, but you can't slavishly follow coverage mechanics under all circumstances.

2) I personally like to see the C get further up the court than center and be a little more active. Just react to the ball while being half-azzed aware of what's happening in your primary. Again, just a personal preference, but I think the C should get over center, get ready for a possible missed shot and then stay there if the play remains there, or if it's made come back at the same pace as the ball is moving back up the court..... rather than hanging back and letting the play come to you.

Just my own peanut gallery opinion.....

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

No way I'm coming all the way to the free throw line on a 1-on-0 break-away as the C if nobody else has made it past half-court. I choose to stick with the stragglers.

Here's something I've learned... your head can actually pivot back & forth on your neck so that you can watch what's going on in a very large area of the court if you need to and still be in position for the next play. Work on that, it's very helpful.

Anyway, we about beat this to death.

[JRutledge]

Why is it every time there is a discussion it has to be personal?

Carry on.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Here's something I've learned... your head can actually pivot back & forth on your neck so that you can watch what's going on in a very large area of the court if you need to and still be in position for the next play. Work on that, it's very helpful.

I just tested it out. It works just as well at half-court as it does at a free throw line.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I just tested it out. It works just as well at half-court as it does at a free throw line.

Good.

Then get your lazy azz past the HC line.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Good.

Then get your lazy azz past the HC line.

Not tonight I won't...just worked 14 games in 3 days at a DIII camp.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Not tonight I won't...just worked 14 games in 3 days at a DIII camp.

Obviously 14 gmes in 3 days at camp is beyond what you can handle.

[mick]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Obviously 14 gmes in 3 days at camp is beyond what you can handle.

I'm okay with 3 games in 14 days.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by mick

I'm okay with 3 games in 14 days.

That's because you hustle on every play

[icallfouls]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

(just like Burr & TV would trust me in my big game with them).

There is no way that Burr and Teddy V are going let you referee your primary all by yourself. These guys have huge ego's and they are going to make you prove to them that you deserve to work your primary alone. If you miss even the most insignificant of calls they are going to call it for you before they let it get passed on. They are not going to let a greenie cost them games or have their names associated with a game that went bad.

Just saying they will know everything that happens in your primary, and if you let something go, they will make the call.

It is what it is.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by icallfouls

There is no way that Burr and Teddy V are going let you referee your primary all by yourself. These guys have huge ego's and they are going to make you prove to them that you deserve to work your primary alone. If you miss even the most insignificant of calls they are going to call it for you before they let it get passed on. They are not going to let a greenie cost them games or have their names associated with a game that went bad.

Just saying they will know everything that happens in your primary, and if you let something go, they will make the call.

It is what it is.

Bullpucky.

Call insignificant crap right in front of another official in that official''s primary?Complete and utter bullpucky.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Bullpucky.

Call insignificant crap right in front of another official in that official''s primary?Complete and utter bullpucky.

He didn't say they should do it...just that they do. And yes, I've certainly seen them and others of their stature come all the way across the court to call something that might have been there or might not.