Timeout to vent - among other things

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I just checked and I got a new rating in the Arbiter: a 2.17 out of 5! The comments were: very unprofessional, bad attitude towards talking to coaches and explaining.
Here is the kicker, I got a 2 in mechanics! I can take all the rest because the coach is an idiot and idiots do what I expect them to. BUT my mechanics should be a 5 even if he does not like the way I will not let him do what he wants. Now he is right, that is Bullsh_t!

Just blow off whatever ratings he gave you. I do have a couple of questions, though:

Could you have gotten a long way from him when he called the first TO? If you walked away and banged him for yelling long-distance, would that have been easier?

After he got ejected, couldn't you have sootd a long ways away from his path while he exited thr gym, forcing him to chase you in order to get his 3rd?

Did you really have to T the assistant for standing, despite the letter-of-the-law?

I know you didn't do all of these things, but I guess after the coach got chucked, anything that can be done to maximize physical distance and minimizing any words with any coaches from that team would be exceptionally helpful. At that point, whether you're right or not, it can become a travesty.

Your assignor will be smart enough that he knows why the rating was that way. Just laugh it off. It will be funny at some point in the future!

[Adam]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Did you really have to T the assistant for standing, despite the letter-of-the-law?

Read the OP again. The assistant was only T'd after he said they were full of crap. The U2 told him he had to be seated; gave him fair warning. The coach's response was what got him the T.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Read the OP again. The assistant was only T'd after he said they were full of crap. The U2 told him he had to be seated; gave him fair warning. The coach's response was what got him the T.

Oh, OK. I'd still wonder if it was absolutely necessary at that point to tell the guy he had to sit down. I'd not have known that the assistant, who would now be the head coach, would have the seat-belt rule. Glad I was not there!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

I'd still wonder if it was absolutely necessary at that point to tell the guy he had to sit down. I'd not have known that the assistant, who would now be the head coach, would have the seat-belt rule. Glad I was not there!

Yes, it's necessary to tell the assistant coach that he's seatbelted. It's the same as telling the head coach. It's part of the penalty and it's the proper mechanic.

You tell them when they're seatbelted so that you (hopefuly) won't have to nail them if they get up and wander. If they do want to get up and wander after being told, then they have no excuse when they get nailed for doing so.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

I'd not have known that the assistant, who would now be the head coach, would have the seat-belt rule.

I'm shocked! Shocked I tell ya!

[Nevadaref]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOracle
I'd not have known that the assistant, who would now be the head coach, would have the seat-belt rule.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I'm shocked! Shocked I tell ya!

Me too, but about a different aspect of that comment. I'm not the least bit surprised that Old School #7 doesn't know the rules.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Just blow off whatever ratings he gave you. I do have a couple of questions, though:

Could you have gotten a long way from him when he called the first TO? If you walked away and banged him for yelling long-distance, would that have been easier?

After he got ejected, couldn't you have sootd a long ways away from his path while he exited thr gym, forcing him to chase you in order to get his 3rd?

Did you really have to T the assistant for standing, despite the letter-of-the-law?

I know you didn't do all of these things, but I guess after the coach got chucked, anything that can be done to maximize physical distance and minimizing any words with any coaches from that team would be exceptionally helpful. At that point, whether you're right or not, it can become a travesty.

Your assignor will be smart enough that he knows why the rating was that way. Just laugh it off. It will be funny at some point in the future!

I don't think you really read my post. I did get out of the coach's path when he was leaving. Not only did he change his path, he stopped and kept running his mouth. As far as the assistant goes, I trust my partner - try it sometime. If my partner said the coach earned the T, knowing everything else that happened, that is what happened. We can't always get out of harm's way.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I don't think you really read my post. I did get out of the coach's path when he was leaving. Not only did he change his path, he stopped and kept running his mouth. As far as the assistant goes, I trust my partner - try it sometime. If my partner said the coach earned the T, knowing everything else that happened, that is what happened. We can't always get out of harm's way.

Why make a snide comment? I was asking you questions. I did not know if the coach had to cross the floor to leave or not. If he had to cross the floor to the opposite corner to leave, on the same side you were standing, could you have gotten farther away? That's all I was wondering.

Also, once your partner whistles anything, there is no more "trust your partner" issue. It's a done deal. It's sad that this got anywhere near that point, and you're unhappy about it for whatever reason. I'd venture to guess that at that point in time, asking/telling the assistant anything would be awfully tough to do without eliciting some reaction. Whether it is right or not, or he deserves another T--cannot argue against it.

[tomegun]

Oracle, my only sadness is for the game of basketball and the fact that it was reduced to this. The rating system is a joke that I often vent about. I know I will never be the most liked official by coaches because I'm going to do what's right and unfortunately that often means situations like this occur. I had this team last year and those two were idiots then to although not to this extreme. We all know they didn't pick the two times I've had them to act like this. This is normal for them and many officials probably let it go. I'm almost sure they let it go because in this state you get fined for getting thrown out and I believe a T too. I was told it will cost the coach $300 for this one.
I made the comment I did because you (Oracle) must not have read my OP. I got out of his direct path. That should have been good enough. It wasn't a pot shot while he was walking out, he had to change his path and he stopped. I'm not going all the way in to the backcourt just to get away from him more. Everyone in the facility saw how this played out. I'm good with the T(s) and I haven't heard much else about them.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Oracle, my only sadness is for the game of basketball and the fact that it was reduced to this. The rating system is a joke that I often vent about. I know I will never be the most liked official by coaches because I'm going to do what's right and unfortunately that often means situations like this occur. I had this team last year and those two were idiots then to although not to this extreme. We all know they didn't pick the two times I've had them to act like this. This is normal for them and many officials probably let it go. I'm almost sure they let it go because in this state you get fined for getting thrown out and I believe a T too. I was told it will cost the coach $300 for this one.
I made the comment I did because you (Oracle) must not have read my OP. I got out of his direct path. That should have been good enough. It wasn't a pot shot while he was walking out, he had to change his path and he stopped. I'm not going all the way in to the backcourt just to get away from him more. Everyone in the facility saw how this played out. I'm good with the T(s) and I haven't heard much else about them.

It is sad that this occurred, T. If he changed direction to yell again, it will be clearly seen on the film, and you cannot be blamed for goading or escalating. That's why I asked. We've been taught and evaluated on getting physical distance during emotionally-charged times with players and coaches, because then complaints have virtually no merit when the film is seen and they've chased you down or moved towards you after you turn and step away. That's why you shouldn't even worry about a rating or comment from that game. I never doubted for a second that you did what you should have done.

It also makes no difference if you are liked or not. It matters if you are respected. Gaining respect requires understanding how to communicate and set expectations for players and coaches, and holding them accountable for crossing the line. I like Patrick Swayze in Road House. "Be nice, until it is time not to be nice." There are a few instances, probably like what you described, where being courteous doesn't buy you much, but more often than not it is a great way to officiate--and live life. Some great officials are feared by everyone, "Quickest T in the league." You can always use a T when being courteous doesn't work on a jerky coach. But most of the great ones don't get there by that route.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Why make a snide comment? I was asking you questions. I did not know if the coach had to cross the floor to leave or not. If he had to cross the floor to the opposite corner to leave, on the same side you were standing, could you have gotten farther away? That's all I was wondering.

Really? Seriously? Should he have made it look like he was running away from the coach? If I saw a ref doing that, I'd assume he left his stones at home.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Really? Seriously? Should he have made it look like he was running away from the coach? If I saw a ref doing that, I'd assume he left his stones at home.

not these, I presume....