vent, vent, vent...

[SWMOzebra]

Sorry, talking to the wife about this didn't really cut it last night! When I talk bball to her she gets that same glazed-over look in her eyes I get when she talks volleyball to me!

Very competitive boys 6th grade league last night and I'm on my 5th (and last game). Coaches pretty much behaving themselves, except for the occassional "Foul!" shout. Naturally, as the clock winds down the losing coach begins to get more and more vocal - mostly with my partner. I ask P about it at a TO and he says he can handle it.

About 2 mins. left in the game and P calls a foul on the floor under this coach's basket. I was not watching the paint and didn't see the contact, but from the trail I do see the coach shout "That was a shooting foul!" and slam his clipboard down on the bench. I run straight over and *tweet* an unsporting T on the coach. I turn to the other coach and ask for a shooter as I begin walking toward the opposite basket.

My P goes tableside as the offending coach walks onto the court several steps to ask me what he did to get the T. I turn and take a couple of steps toward him and from there it goes like this:

ME: Coach, I'm not going to tolerate that kind of unsportsman like conduct. Have a seat.
COACH: I wasn't talking to you, so tell me what I did to you to earn a T?
ME: Have a seat, coach. I don't care who you were talking to.
COACH: If it's so bad, why didn't your partner call the T?
PARTNER: Coach, please sit down...you don't want the second one.
COACH: (a few more steps onto the floor, now out about 5' in front of table) I just want to know why he called the foul and not you.
ME: *tweet* Second technical foul, the game will not continue until you leave the building.

Game mgmt escorts him out of the building and we finish the game. Both parnter and game mgmt agreed that this was handled properly.

Thanks for letting me vent, needed to unload to folks who understand. All I got from the wife was she thought my blood sugar was low and I should drink a "Powerade" during the 4th game!

[Ref Daddy]

[QUOTE=SWMOzebra]

ME: Coach, I'm not going to tolerate that kind of unsportsman like conduct. Have a seat.
COACH: I wasn't talking to you, so tell me what I did to you to earn a T?
ME: It's not about me, or him, Coach, its about the rules of the game and enforcement of them".

[fiasco]

That reminds me of the church league game I did last week. Player is jawing at me and my partner toward the end of the first half. I finally give him a warning in the second half, so he directed his efforts at P. A few minutes later, P calls a foul on this kid's team and he goes half berzerk. I T'em up and he starts going off on me about how I don't have the right to T him up because he was talking to my P.

Then, as the other team was shooting the T free throws, and I'm at the baseline administering the FTs, HE WALKS TOWARD ME WITH A LOOK ON HIS FACE LIKE HE'S GOING TO CUSS ME OUT. The second he steps inside the 3pt line, my whistle blows and he's out of the game.

Granted, this was just a church league game with little or no coaching, but I just thought his "you can't T me up cause I wasn't talking to you" line was funny.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by SWMOzebra

I run straight over and *tweet* an unsporting T on the coach.

You "ran over" to give the T?

I turn to the other coach and ask for a shooter as I begin walking toward the opposite basket.

Since there was a common foul followed by a T, you should get together with your partner to be sure all is reported correctly and you know what's going to happen next, and who is going to talk to the coach.

My P goes tableside as the offending coach walks onto the court several steps to ask me what he did to get the T. I turn and take a couple of steps toward him and from there it goes like this:

It's unclear to me who the coach was talking to, but, depending on your comfort and his "level of excitement" you could have given him an explanation -- "slamming the clipboard while shouting is unsporting" while conversing in a normal tone and walking him back to his bench. I wouldn't have the conversation across the court (again, it's unclear how far away you were, but you never answered his question of *What* did he do)

[zebraman]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

but you never answered his question of *What* did he do)

I'm all for dialogue between a coach and an official, but if a coach slams his clipboard to the floor and then asks me what he did to deserve the T, I may not even answer. It's just too obvious.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by SWMOzebra

ME: Coach, I'm not going to tolerate that kind of unsportsman like conduct. Have a seat.
COACH: I wasn't talking to you, so tell me what I did to you to earn a T?
ME: Have a seat, coach. I don't care who you were talking to.
COACH: If it's so bad, why didn't your partner call the T?
PARTNER: Coach, please sit down...you don't want the second one.
COACH: (a few more steps onto the floor, now out about 5' in front of table) I just want to know why he called the foul and not you.
ME: *tweet* Second technical foul, the game will not continue until you leave the building.

Thanks for letting me vent, needed to unload to folks who understand. All I got from the wife was she thought my blood sugar was low and I should drink a "Powerade" during the 4th game!

No problem on the venting but I agree with your wife. You let the coach get to you. I don't think coaches have to pass a class and get 80% on a test to qualify to be a coach. Remember that. Don't assume that everyone knows the rules. I always recommend giving people the benefit of the doubt.

Your correspondence with the coach was condescending, IMHO. The coach asked you a question on why he got a technical? Nobody answered that. Coach: you got the T because you threw the clipboard down. Walk away, don't antagonize him. When the coach says, If it's so bad, why didn't your partner call the T? That question doesn't deserve an answer or a response from you or your partner. I can't think of anything that you can say that going to answer that question and not lead to more unpleasant discussions. You answered his initial question, he now knows why he got the T, walk away to administrator F/T's. Last, only respond to questions asked respectively. Do not, repeat, do not respond to questions by a coach that are dumb or not appropiate, and remember, you do not have to answer every questions.

[tjones1]

We've always talked about this in our pre-game. If we whack a coach, we are reporting it to the table and getting out of there. This saves the same official from getting the coach twice. We get together so we are on the same page, why the T was assessed, and go from there. One of the non-calling officials goes and tells the coach they are seat belted for the rest of the game. If the coach doesn't really know why they got whacked (which they usually do) the non-calling official has the answer to that question.

[chartrusepengui]

When a coach behaves like a 3 year old having a tantrum throwing down his clipboard - he does not deserve ANY explanation. He is not going to listen to you anyway - he is just trying to rattle you and put center of attention on him/herself instead of where it ought to be. Just like the 3 year old. I think you handled it efficently.

Later, at an appropriate time when both are a bit calmer a conversation might take place. But, lets face it - if I coach throws/slams anything - they know exactly why they got the T. This comes from experience as a JV coach, varsity coach and official.

[Ignats75]

No problem on the venting but I agree with your wife. You let the coach get to you. I don't think coaches have to pass a class and get 80% on a test to qualify to be a coach. Remember that. Don't assume that everyone knows the rules. I always recommend giving people the benefit of the doubt.

So, now ignorance IS a defense before the law? I say your are full of crapola and a real piece of work If a coach throws a clipboard onto the floor so that I can hear it, and its a reaction to a call, WHACK.

If he asked me why I tee'd him up, I would ask him, "Why do you think?"

[SWMOzebra]

In retrospect, I might be forced to agree with my wife that the second T came too quickly. Since I made the mistake of turning to address him (we were separated by 3-4') instead of letting my P handle as I should of, I'm afraid that I "trapped" myself into giving #2. I wouldn't say he was disrespectful, just sarcastic as he knew perfectly well why he got the call originally. He tried to make the case to game mgmt. that the clipboard "slipped" out of his hand and I over-reacted. However, since I was opposite of the table on trail, I saw the entire episode clearly.

It's true that 99% of his calls from the bench were directed at my P, who admittedly loathes to call techs. As a rookie, I always look to learn at least one thing from a new experience and this was certainly my first time to DQ a coach...I hope when faced with a situation like this again that I'll be more patient with the second.

Thanks again for letting me vent, I've learned a great deal from this board and appreciate the insight everyone offers!

[Ignats75]

As a rookie, I always look to learn at least one thing from a new experience and this was certainly my first time to DQ a coach...I hope when faced with a situation like this again that I'll be more patient with the second.

Thanks again for letting me vent, I've learned a great deal from this board and appreciate the insight everyone offers!

Everyone can be such a dangerous word.

[blindzebra]

The first T was a good one...although running over isn't, try to handle it like any other call.

You and your partner have calls to report, and a sequence of events that will be occurring, so back up, meet up and do so as far away from the coach as possible...at that point your partner makes his report, than you make yours.

Typically, I prefer the non-calling official handle the coach post-T, but in this case, you pretty much whacked him for your partner and his questions...as stupid as they are, he knows why he got it...are directed at you, and his biggest beef is still probably with your partner.

I'd have your partner administer the FTs for the T and I'd handle the coach:

Coach: Why did I get the T?

Me: Coach, you've been very vocal about calls all game, and when something like throwing a clip board is included, that is automatic...you lost your box and you'll need to take a seat.

Then walk away.

[JRutledge]

The coach's behavior probably should have been dealt with much earlier in the game. Waiting until the last 2 minutes means that if you allowed something to go on the rest of the game, the more and more a coach or player gets heated if in their minds nothing really changes. If it had been taken care of earlier, then when you give the coach a T, they would not be asking such a stupid question like, "What did I do to get a T?"

Peace

[swkansasref33]

Originally Posted by Old School

No problem on the venting but I agree with your wife. You let the coach get to you. I don't think coaches have to pass a class and get 80% on a test to qualify to be a coach. Remember that.

In Kansas they do, and its 90% for us not 80%. And in places where they don't, they should IMO

[mjbofficial]

Originally Posted by fiasco

That reminds me of the church league game I did last week. Player is jawing at me and my partner toward the end of the first half. I finally give him a warning in the second half, so he directed his efforts at P. A few minutes later, P calls a foul on this kid's team and he goes half berzerk. I T'em up and he starts going off on me about how I don't have the right to T him up because he was talking to my P.

Then, as the other team was shooting the T free throws, and I'm at the baseline administering the FTs, HE WALKS TOWARD ME WITH A LOOK ON HIS FACE LIKE HE'S GOING TO CUSS ME OUT. The second he steps inside the 3pt line, my whistle blows and he's out of the game.

Granted, this was just a church league game with little or no coaching, but I just thought his "you can't T me up cause I wasn't talking to you" line was funny.

Ha, that reminds me of a situation I had this weekend. Youth league (jr. high age) game. I call a block on B1 as he is trying to press A1. The kid starts yelling at me and says "when your feet are set, that's a charge!!!!". I told the kid to knock it and that was enough but there is no doubt in my mind that I should have T'd him. I guess I didn't because it was a youth game but after about a minute I realized that I should have at least T'd him and I've been kicking myself ever since.