Don't mess with the scorekeeper!

[Back In The Saddle]

There's a very little school about 90 minutes from my house that I've been to several times over the past few years. The coaches come and go, but the table crew has been the same for years. The principal runs the clock. And the scorekeeper, who is probably the secretary, is great.

I was there for my first HS games this year. Somewhere in the 4th quarter of the frosh game the scoreboard went off. I knew to within roughly a minute what the proper time should be, she had it to within 10 seconds because she had recorded the time of the last held ball.

Was there last Friday again. A couple minutes before the V game starts, she pulls out a current rule book. I start giving her the business about if she's got a rule book we're going to have to really be on our toes tonight. She chuckles and tells us that an official in a recent game called a double foul, but said not to go with the AP arrow to resume play. We took a minute during the introductions (with frequent interruptions to bump knuckles with the starters) to show her the recent change to POI. She flips over to the rule about when to go with the AP, which includes double fouls. We explain what the second part of that rule means. She thanked us and we got on with the game.

Thinking back, I cannot recall ever having even the slightest problem with the table at that school. I'd like to clone this lady and carry a copy in my bag to every game I work. I wouldn't even have to carry my rule book any more. She carries one and can find what she's looking for as fast as I can.

[tjones1]

We've got a guy in my area that's the same way. Every year he goes to the rules meetings (which, obviously, he doesn't have to). I've always heard him say "you've got to be crazy if you're going to go into a game in the dark." It certainly makes sense; I wish there were more like him.

[mbyron]

Some folks take their role as an official seriously.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

I'd like to clone this lady and carry a copy in my bag to every game I work.

From what I've read on here, I would bet that tjones has already done that.

[JugglingReferee]

Ya'll heard about some less-than-qualified table crews that I had in my past.

Was assigned to the final two years in a row in this one particular tournament; age level = 17 year olds (maybe some 18 - not sure). The TD did something very unusual: he delayed the start of the game by 5 minutes because the person he wanted to scorekeep the game was en route from another tournament venue.

My point is that yes, there are some scorekeepers that take their job seriously. I think scorekeeping comes more naturally to them.

[jeffpea]

much like local officials associations in various parts of the country, the state of Wisconsin actual has an Officials Scorers Association. They wear black jackets with their association patches (similar to the jackets we all wear during pre-game) to games and are GREAT to have on your games. Since I've only worked college games in WI, I can only assume that they also work HS games, but others on this forum from WI probably can shed some light on that....

[That Don Guy]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

There's a very little school about 90 minutes from my house that I've been to several times over the past few years. The coaches come and go, but the table crew has been the same for years. The principal runs the clock. And the scorekeeper, who is probably the secretary, is great.

I was there for my first HS games this year. Somewhere in the 4th quarter of the frosh game the scoreboard went off. I knew to within roughly a minute what the proper time should be, she had it to within 10 seconds because she had recorded the time of the last held ball.

Doesn't everybody? (Okay, I have a little more experience than most scorers - I did my high school's home varsity book for over 20 straight years, so I know what to expect from coaches - I always write down when held balls take place so if somebody thinks the arrow is pointing the wrong way, I can show them when the last held ball was and who got the ball because of it.)

Was there last Friday again. A couple minutes before the V game starts, she pulls out a current rule book. I start giving her the business about if she's got a rule book we're going to have to really be on our toes tonight.

I also made it a point to carry the rule book and case book - and even, on occasion, the NF Spirit (cheerleading) Rules, just in case one of the halftime routines tried something considered too dangerous to be allowed in competition (the last thing a high school needs is an accident followed by a lawsuit).

Was she wearing the "strongly recommended black and white striped shirt?" I tried that once, and got an earful from the officials (remember, the officials are "a referee and one or two umpires, assisted by the timer(s) and scorer(s)"). After that, I started wearing a rugby shirt with black and white horizontal stripes; I noted, "The book says to wear a black and white striped shirt; it says nothing about the direction of the stripes!"

She chuckles and tells us that an official in a recent game called a double foul, but said not to go with the AP arrow to resume play.

That brings up the main reason of this post. The official scorer is supposed to make sure the arrow is pointing in the right direction; what are the mechanics in a situation where a held ball is called, but there is a foul before the throw-in takes place (I know, it's "before the throw-in ends," but one of the unwritten rules I learned early on is, if it's close, switch the arrow)? Is the reporting official supposed to tell the scorer whether or not to switch the arrow? Is the scorer supposed to ask?

-- Don

[Stat-Man]

Originally Posted by tjones1

We've got a guy in my area that's the same way. Every year he goes to the rules meetings (which, obviously, he doesn't have to). I've always heard him say "you've got to be crazy if you're going to go into a game in the dark." It certainly makes sense; I wish there were more like him.

I make sure I have the most recent NFHS rule changes and my CYO league's special rules in a binder when I go to games. It came in handy last weekend when the one referee was trying to enforce a no-press rule that was revised prior to last season.

I do try to take my job seriously, especially at home games.

[Stat-Man]

Originally Posted by That Don Guy

That brings up the main reason of this post. The official scorer is supposed to make sure the arrow is pointing in the right direction; what are the mechanics in a situation where a held ball is called, but there is a foul before the throw-in takes place (I know, it's "before the throw-in ends," but one of the unwritten rules I learned early on is, if it's close, switch the arrow)? Is the reporting official supposed to tell the scorer whether or not to switch the arrow? Is the scorer supposed to ask?

-- Don

A lot of scorers and referees (at least in my locale) don't seem to know the arrow doesn't change in this scenario. A lot of the time, I feel like I'm the only who knows this. In an NCAA-W game tho, a team control foul was called on an AP throw-in and the home timer changed the arrow and would not believe me when I told him it doesn't change. I asked the officials to check into at the half and told them where to look in the rule book. Sure enough, they came back for the second half and told me that although the section i gave them was incorrect, they did find the rule and would have the arrow changed back. Of course the home table crew and coach are arguing about it and want to know why the arrow is going back to us.

I would recommend an official use preventive officiating in this scenario and remind whoever is maintaining the arrow that it shouldn't change.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Ya'll heard about some less-than-qualified table crews that I had in my past.

"Ya'll"??? Are you from south Canada or what, eh????

[SCalScoreKeeper]

If you know this association's website please post it on this board or email it to me at [email protected]!

[steve33]

I make it a point to not only carry a rule book with me to the table, but to also keep a seperate tally of Timeouts remaining because the coaches can get quite firey about their timeout count.