Double Technical - Player Disqualification

[Nevadaref]

JR,
If you reread the OP closely, it is unclear when the sub was allowed into the game. The OP says that he noticed the removal of the jersey as he was about to report the T for the unsporting behavior.

Personally, I would have reported the foul before allowing any substitutes. So perhaps an indirect to the coach is not appropriate here. Certainly the player had not yet been DQ'd as the official hadn't even reported his second T yet, let alone inform the coach.

[coach41]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

JR,
If you reread the OP closely, it is unclear when the sub was allowed into the game. The OP says that he noticed the removal of the jersey as he was about to report the T for the unsporting behavior.

Personally, I would have reported the foul before allowing any substitutes. So perhaps an indirect to the coach is not appropriate here. Certainly the player had not yet been DQ'd as the official hadn't even reported his second T yet, let alone inform the coach.

This is correct. As I can recall the sequence, I gave the player the first "T" and informed my partner. Then I went to the table to report the "T" and noticed that the player had been subbed out and also took his jersey off. That was when I issued the second "T" and ejected him.

After saturday's game, I realize why it is so important to be in control of the game and not let the "emotions" and other things overwhelm you personally.

I feel I am fairly calm during tense games but sometimes I get so locked in (ignoring the crowds, etc, etc) to "reffing the games" that I neglect the game management part of the games. I did better saturday in talking to players and coaches but obviously a few things I probably could have improved.

How do most of you keep yourselves locked into all you have to do as a ref? Is it through experience? Or is that something that can be learned?

[Nevadaref]

Honestly, it's can be learned and is just a matter of having been there and done it over and over many times. You'll get there. All of us still make mistakes.

So how did the sub get onto the court, if neither you nor your partner beckoned him in? Sounds as if you could have had yet another technical foul. Not that I would recommend making an issue out of that one.

[Ref in PA]

Originally Posted by coach41

How do most of you keep yourselves locked into all you have to do as a ref? Is it through experience? Or is that something that can be learned?

Yes.

Yes, through experience.

[armymanjones]

Originally Posted by Ref in PA

Yes.

Yes, through experience.

I agree. You definately learn through experience and repetition

[TheOracle]

Stuff all sounds reasonable. I like the fact you gave the kid a chance to stop reacting, then took care of business.

One way to keep game management strong during technicals: your partner should come to you after you give a T, and state exactly what will happen from that point forward. They should take control and let you just ride along. Almost everyone gets a little pumped/goofy when they call a T, and can use help. If you called those 2 T's, I'd have grabbed you, and asked if you had a double T. I would have then said, "OK, we have the foul on white 12, then a double T on white 12. The sub is in the game. We're going to shoot 4 free throws for blue, then get the teams lined up for the one-and-one for blue. You go administrate the free throws to get away from that bench, and I'll stay back here. OK?"

You will learn to see the big picture by doing games. The fact you are being introspective about it is huge. You'll put those pieces together and improve in a hurry. Keep up the good work!

[Stat-Man]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

If you called those 2 T's, I'd have grabbed you, and asked if you had a double T. I would have then said, "OK, we have the foul on white 12, then a double T on white 12. The sub is in the game. We're going to shoot 4 free throws for blue, then get the teams lined up for the one-and-one for blue. You go administrate the free throws to get away from that bench, and I'll stay back here. OK?"

Speaking NF, wouldn't the 1&1 be shot first, followed by the technical foul free throws, and then a throw-in? (What you posted appears to be true for NCAA)

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Stat-Man

Speaking NF, wouldn't the 1&1 be shot first, followed by the technical foul free throws, and then a throw-in? (What you posted appears to be true for NCAA)

Correct, for NFHS you'd shoot the 1&1 w/ lane cleared, then 4 technical FTs, then ball out at division line for offended team.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

One way to keep game management strong during technicals: your partner should come to you after you give a T, and state exactly what will happen from that point forward.

I don't want my partner coming over and telling me what is going to happen after any of my calls. I already know. I made the d@mn call!

If I want their input of help, I will go to them. Also, I don't feel the need to run away from a coach after T'ing him. I hate it when a partner comes running over and thinks that I need to leave after a T. The official on the other side of the floor has no idea what caused the T. Most of my Ts are actually because the coach is upset with my partner and I am protecting their back. Now the official that the coach is upset with has come right over into the fire.

I pregame that we leave the decision up to the calling official. If he wants to leave that area, he just walks to the opposite side of the floor and someone else fills in. If that official is okay to stay, then he stays put.

[BillyMac]

From Nevadaref: "I don't feel the need to run away from a coach after T'ing him. I hate it when a partner comes running over and thinks that I need to leave after a T."

I agree. After a simple player disqualification (5 fouls), our IAABO mechanics require that the non calling official inform the coach that the player has been disqualified. I hate that mechanic. It makes it look like I'm afraid of the coach. In my pregame, I tell my partner that under normaL circumstances, if I'm the calling official, I will tell the coach that his or her player is disqualified, unless I believe that my presence near the coach will lead to a technical foul on the coach, in which case I will ask my partner to inform the coach about the disqualification. Same thing for a technical foul that will lead to the coach losing his or her coaching box privilege. If I make the call, I will tell the coach, again, unless my leaving can prevent a second technical foul. In twenty-six years of officiaiting, I've never handed this off to my partner, but, neverthless, I may need my partner's help someday.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by coach41

How do most of you keep yourselves locked into all you have to do as a ref? Is it through experience? Or is that something that can be learned?

Both learning and experience. What you work on is getting the little things to become habits, so that you don't have to be "locked into" them. This is how you learn to read. You start with phonics, but you don't use phonics when you are an adult, except when you discover a new word. SO with reffing, you start by consciously having to think about all the details, but as they become more automatic, you begin to learn to parse the sentences and paragraphs, so to speak. You can learn all this more quickly by not only reffing, but also talking about reffing, and watching good refs from the stands.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

Both learning and experience. What you work on is getting the little things to become habits, so that you don't have to be "locked into" them. This is how you learn to read. You start with phonics, but you don't use phonics when you are an adult, except when you discover a new word. SO with reffing, you start by consciously having to think about all the details, but as they become more automatic, you begin to learn to parse the sentences and paragraphs, so to speak. You can learn all this more quickly by not only reffing, but also talking about reffing, and watching good refs from the stands.

I think I agree with this. But I had trouble with some of the big words; so I'm not entirely sure.